The Elio Engine

[electroken]

Even if classified as a motorcycle, can motorcycles legally vent the crankcase to the atmosphere from the factory? None of the bikes I have owned from the last 30 years did that, I really do not recall if my older bikes vented to the airbox or atmo.

I did modify one of my bikes to ditch the airbox and use individual Uni pod filters so had a crankcase filter like Elio is using. But since that was modifying the stock emissions equipment it was technically illegal.

Every factory motorcycle crankcase breather I've seen since 1980 has been routed through the air box. Both 1972 Hondas in the garage came with draft tubes vented directly to atmosphere.

 

[WilliamH]

Come on now, you're old enough to remember when they used to put breathers on the valve covers; that were later replaced by EGR valves.
Same thing.

They looked like this from the bottom
View attachment 21334

And like this from the top

View attachment 21336

Sure, I also remember rebuilding Dynaflow and Dual Path transmissions in the early'60s but I haven't seen a breather in years.

 

[RSchneider]

Any thoughts on the inline coolant thermostat that Elio is using?

 

[booboo]

Any thoughts on the inline coolant thermostat that Elio is using?

Yes, Thanks, I was wondering what it was, now I know.
I assume and hope it is as simple and reliable as the old ones. Also no gasket so easier to replace, yea.
Looked it up, seems they are an old one sandwiched in a housing. Still looks like an easier replacement, with an O ring seal.
http://thumbs3.ebaystatic.com/d/l225/m/m69Ko5I2GYJ8xPHUpSPhBxQ.jpg

 

[Mel]

Every factory motorcycle crankcase breather I've seen since 1980 has been routed through the air box. Both 1972 Hondas in the garage came with draft tubes vented directly to atmosphere.

Venting through the air box is not the same as PCV. Venting through the air box is simply using the same filter as the throttle body.
PCV vents into the intake manifold.

 

[electroken]

Venting through the air box is not the same as PCV. Venting through the air box is simply using the same filter as the throttle body.
PCV vents into the intake manifold.

At no time did I mention a PCV valve.

What I WAS doing was providing two points in time that exhibited different methods of crankcase ventilation in motorcycles.

 

[Mel]

At no time did I mention a PCV valve.
What I WAS doing was providing two points in time that exhibited different methods of crankcase ventilation in motorcycles.

The point of my post was that PCV is required for new US automobiles. I'm pretty sure that it is not required for motorcycles, in which case venting to the atmosphere is likely acceptable at this point.

 

[RSchneider]

If Elio goes with that $20 K&N crankcase vent, you can pretty much guarantee there will be thousands of complaints. Everything from the engine compartment becoming a oily/dirty mess and the smell of hot oil while driving down the road. I suspect that Elio will vent it in the intake downstream of the throttle body. This is because it makes the crankcase operate under a vacuum most of the time. As we all know, running a vacuum in the crankcase is a great way to increase the sealing for the rings. You can run low tension rings yet get the sealing of high tension ones. In addition to that, for a "green" car, it makes no sense to burn off the oil vapors. Same reason why it really needs a CAT and fuel tank canister that is vented to the intake. It's OK if you are using the car as an enthusiast, but with 250K being sold per year, the average person cranking out 25K miles per year for going back and forth to work all over the country in various climates (i.e. Bangor ME, Phoenix, AZ etc) K&N filters for the crankcase vent and intake filter don't cut it.

I also hope they fix all of the cooling systems issues that are prevalent in the latest pic of the engine. Maybe the next momentum will cover that.

 

[WilliamH]

If Elio goes with that $20 K&N crankcase vent, you can pretty much guarantee there will be thousands of complaints. Everything from the engine compartment becoming a oily/dirty mess and the smell of hot oil while driving down the road. I suspect that Elio will vent it in the intake downstream of the throttle body. This is because it makes the crankcase operate under a vacuum most of the time. As we all know, running a vacuum in the crankcase is a great way to increase the sealing for the rings. You can run low tension rings yet get the sealing of high tension ones. In addition to that, for a "green" car, it makes no sense to burn off the oil vapors. Same reason why it really needs a CAT and fuel tank canister that is vented to the intake. It's OK if you are using the car as an enthusiast, but with 250K being sold per year, the average person cranking out 25K miles per year for going back and forth to work all over the country in various climates (i.e. Bangor ME, Phoenix, AZ etc) K&N filters for the crankcase vent and intake filter don't cut it.

I also hope they fix all of the cooling systems issues that are prevalent in the latest pic of the engine. Maybe the next momentum will cover that.

What cooling system issues?
Please expand you remark.

 

[RSchneider]

I have to wait for Elio's response.