Why The Prototypes Have To Wait On The Engine

[JEBar]

the last election may indicate for that time in history, the silent majority got fed up and expressed itself .... unfortunately, history says those elected in such major shifts tend to believe they have been ordained to move the country to an extreme position in a different direction .... I really wish the pendulum would settle somewhere close to the middle

 

[WilliamH]

Well this is a dilemma, now isn't it?
We all want the freedom to choose to be safe or not. But once someone chooses to be unsafe and now all of a sudden, that impacts ME...well now we have a problem. It's the same for:

• Helmet use. If they are a vegetable and my insurance goes up, I have a problem.
• Smokers. If I have to pay extra for their medical issues, I have a problem.
• Extreme sports people. If you decide to risk your life by climbing that mountain, then I have to foot the bill for a rescue, I have a problem.
• Seat belts. I don't care if you wear a seatbelt or not, but if because of your lack of safety precautions, I'm effected, I have a problem. This actually goes even deeper. If I am in an accident, and it's my fault, and someone ends up dying, but they weren't wearing a seatbelt... I know, we can't blame the victim, but should I be held liable for killing someone, when they were actually just as reckless as I was?

* drops mic...steps off soap box *

Helmet use -------- obstructs peripheral vision and impairs hearing. (especially full face) (safety hazard.)
Smoking ------------ stopped cold turkey 20 years ago from 3 packs a day. (If everyone did, the politicians would cry over lost taxes.)
Extreme Sports --- no thank you
Seat belts ----------- Started using them when I got my AH in '61. They keep you behind the wheel and in control of your car during emergency maneuvers. (Just don't like the inertial re-tractors. I know how to adjust my own belts.)

In three of the four that you mentioned we have to deal with the law of unintended consequences.

 

[RUCRAYZE]

the last election may indicate for that time in history, the silent majority got fed up and expressed itself .... unfortunately, history says those elected in such major shifts tend to believe they have been ordained to move the country to an extreme position in a different direction .... I really wish the pendulum would settle somewhere close to the middle

well doesn't it, except for the occasional "landslide" most elected officials win within a few percentage points of the other. Even with the "lopsided" results of the last presidential election (based on Electoral College-don't get me started on that institution) the popular vote was about 49-51%

 

[RUCRAYZE]

nice chatting this morning- but it's time for me to do some productive work!
Catch you-all later

 

[JEBar]

nice chatting this morning- but it's time for me to do some productive work!
Catch you-all later

 

[CompTrex]

Helmet use -------- obstructs peripheral vision and impairs hearing. (especially full face) (safety hazard.)
Smoking ------------ stopped cold turkey 20 years ago from 3 packs a day. (If everyone did, the politicians would cry over lost taxes.)
Extreme Sports --- no thank you
Seat belts ----------- Started using them when I got my AH in '61. They keep you behind the wheel and in control of your car during emergency maneuvers. (Just don't like the inertial re-tractors. I know how to adjust my own belts.)

In three of the four that you mentioned we have to deal with the law of unintended consequences.

Again, I don't really care what you do, but if you choose to be unsafe or reckless or even free, I shouldn't have to pay a penalty.

Well, I do care that you quit smoking! Kudos!

 

[Johnapool]

Going back to the original subject of this thread "Why The Prototypes Have To Wait On The Engine" , Sr.MailMan, in The "Elio Engine" thread posted a link to a story in Jalopnik. (Pg 102 #1015) ..... http://jalopnik.com/why-fords-tiny-1-liter-3-cylinder-is-the-future-of-ga-1543662936
I extracted a paragraph which relates to this subject
........"Three-cylinder engines, since they have one less cylinder than the engine has cycles, are known for their distinctive back-and-forth pitching motion as they run. Most triples solve this with balance shafts, but those can add weight and rob power. Ford tackled the issue by sort of skirting it: they used an eccentrically-weighted flywheel and front pulley to compensate for that missing-cylinder cycle, and they're essentially translating the vertical pitching motion into a lateral motion, which the car's special engine mounts can easily absorb. The result is that very little engine hopping happens at all."..............
So it appears that in a very lightweight body, positioning and motor mounts could be critical to the handling of the car.
Not to mention that the motor mounts become more critical than in a lot of other vehicles.
If you've ever been in a car with a broken motor mount you understand the issue.

I wonder how Suzuki managed vibrations from the Geo Metro engine?

 

[outsydthebox]

I wonder how Suzuki managed vibrations form the Geo Metro engine?

Thank You! No separate balance shaft and it doesn't shake itself to death. The writer of that article obviously thought he knew what he was talking about. My "guess" is, he "heard" that (sales pitch) from an official Ford rep. Sometimes it's hard to separate "the facts" from "the hype".

 

[John Painter]

Going back to the original subject of this thread "Why The Prototypes Have To Wait On The Engine" , Sr.MailMan, in The "Elio Engine" thread posted a link to a story in Jalopnik. (Pg 102 #1015) ..... http://jalopnik.com/why-fords-tiny-1-liter-3-cylinder-is-the-future-of-ga-1543662936
I extracted a paragraph which relates to this subject
........"Three-cylinder engines, since they have one less cylinder than the engine has cycles, are known for their distinctive back-and-forth pitching motion as they run. Most triples solve this with balance shafts, but those can add weight and rob power. Ford tackled the issue by sort of skirting it: they used an eccentrically-weighted flywheel and front pulley to compensate for that missing-cylinder cycle, and they're essentially translating the vertical pitching motion into a lateral motion, which the car's special engine mounts can easily absorb. The result is that very little engine hopping happens at all."..............
So it appears that in a very lightweight body, positioning and motor mounts could be critical to the handling of the car.
Not to mention that the motor mounts become more critical than in a lot of other vehicles.
If you've ever been in a car with a broken motor mount you understand the issue.

I think Tavarish has some sort of grudge with Paul Elio, or is just losing it. I'd agree with the what he's saying here for existing engines.....

HELLO Elio's engine is hot off the press. The Elio is a straight 3 where the crankshaft is arranged so the pistons reach the top of their travel in an evenly timed and spaced sequence, so timing is evenly divided over the number of cylinders in the engine, which has a natural harmonic balancing effect.

I am guessing, but I think IAV probably has just a little more competence than Tavarish in designing engines for a particular objective. Though one never knows, maybe PE is planning on getting that increased mileage by hopping like a bunny...

 

[Charlie G]

The voting system we use by it's very nature encourages polarization and nurtures a 2-party system.
There are alternatives that encourage more compromise, but they're unlikely to take hold because they would need to be implemented by that very system.
When the margins are 49-51%, nearly half your country is going to be unhappy, and most of the other half just voted for what they saw as the lesser of two evils.

These things being said, can we ditch the politics and get back to the Elio?

It was strange for me to read all the discussion about adding a fourth wheel to meet reclassification requirements - have we already forgotten the Aptera?