The Real P5 ?

[Rickb]

Turbochargers do generally improve the engine efficiency, which is part of how they produce more power. The issue is that overall vehicle efficiency depends heavily on how it is driven and how well matched the engine, transmission and rest of the vehicle are. When you add a turbo to an existing vehicle, the engine torque curve is not going to match the gearing as well. And then there's the lead foot effect ...

Rick, where did you get the 4.5sec 0-60 time for an EV Elio? I didn't think they had even looked at EV other than just the notion that they might consider it later.

Anyway, EVs can feel quick because they produce maximum torque at just above zero rpm. It'll depend on the exact motor specs and gearing whether it'll actually end up faster in 0-60, though.

I mentioned the EV only as an indication that there is market interest in an Elio EV or somebody will retrofit an Elio to electric and it will be high performance.

 

[cantwait]

You may be right. But if you are in the position where the best you can afford is a 10 year old clunker with 150K miles on it you may not care about 0-60 as much as you do about something that gets you from home to work and back Monday thru Friday without any major problems.

Agreed, but that would be capturing the econocar driver market, not the motorcycle demographic. As is, they will only be capturing motorcyclists, coincidentally, not "because" they are motorcyclists.

 

[WilliamH]

Agreed, but that would be capturing the econocar driver market, not the motorcycle demographic. As is, they will only be capturing motorcyclists, coincidentally, not "because" they are motorcyclists.

When I was still riding most of my friends had their Harley and their 'old lady' had a beat up old clunker or maybe a van or pickup they used as a chase car on poker runs. I think there are a lot more people who need reliable transportation than there are bikers who will be converted. My conversion to full time cager came with a 'not quite perfect' spinal fusion.

 

[Rickb]

When I was still riding most of my friends had their Harley and their 'old lady' had a beat up old clunker or maybe a van or pickup they used as a chase car on poker runs. I think there are a lot more people who need reliable transportation than there are bikers who will be converted. My conversion to full time cager came with a 'not quite perfect' spinal fusion.

As a former biker were you personally attracted to the Elio because it was a narrow enclosed cabin motorcycle that looked fun to drive, because you drove a clunker and needed reliable transportation, or both?

I think the point was will motorcyclists in general or older retiring bikers, getting off motorcycles for whatever the reason, be attracted to the Elio as a viable demographic that should be marketed to or will they say "it looks like a damn scooter or something my 'old lady' would drive " as they roll on the ground with laughter.

 

[WilliamH]

As a former biker were you personally attracted to the Elio because it was a narrow enclosed cabin motorcycle that looked fun to drive, because you drove a clunker and needed reliable transportation, or both?

I think the point was will motorcyclists in general or older retiring bikers, getting off motorcycles for whatever the reason, be attracted to the Elio as a viable demographic that should be marketed to or will they say "it looks like a damn scooter or something my 'old lady' would drive " as they roll on the ground with laughter.

Straight answer....... Neither. My 2011 Ford Lariat Ecoboost 4x4, which I special ordered, is in great shape with only about 76K miles on it. My '95 Wrangler has about 160K on it but I use it mostly as a ranch vehicle.
I was attracted to the Elio because it is cheap, gets high mileage, is available with a 5 speed manual, and looks like it will be fun to drive. As I have also mentioned, the nearest town is a 60 mile round trip, the nearest WalMart is a 120 mile round trip, and my doctor is a 220 mile round trip.
Fun factor .... It kind of reminded me of the Lotus 7. (edit at 8:34 pm)

 

[McBrew]

I think some people are stuck on the legal definition in regards to the number of wheels. The Elio is a motorcycle just as much as my wheelbarrow is a unicycle.

Front wheel drive. Enclosed cabin. Airbags. Air conditioning. Windshield wiper. Steering wheel. Seat belts. Yeah... Sounds just like a motorcycle to me.

 

[Rickb]

I think some people are stuck on the legal definition in regards to the number of wheels. The Elio is a motorcycle just as much as my wheelbarrow is a unicycle.

Front wheel drive. Enclosed cabin. Airbags. Air conditioning. Windshield wiper. Steering wheel. Seat belts. Yeah... Sounds just like a motorcycle to me.

Is a three wheel motorcycle a motorcycle or a different vehicle class than a two wheel Motorcycle? It really doesn't matter in the big scheme except for registration, licensing, and helmets. My thought is driving a narrow enclosed cabin vehicle dead center in the highway lane is going to feel more like driving/riding a motorcycle than a car and that's the reason for my attraction to the Elio. It's not so much stuck on the number of wheels, but a fun climate controlled enclosed motorcycle driving experience.

Do you consider this a motorcycle or a car because of the enclosed climate controlled cabin, windshield wiper, 2 seats, and seat belt restraints?

 

[Gizmo]

Hmmm.... no lean, steering wheel, foot peddles, enclosed cabin, car style seat, etc. I think it'll feel like a car. I've driven vehicles with the steering wheel on the other side. After very little time it felt normal. In fact it's been 27 years and I still tend to drive on the left half of a lane when there aren't any lines like in parking lots. Drives me nuts. It's very hard for me to think "motorcycle" when looking at the Elio. It screams car to me regardless how it's legally classified. Add lean into the picture and that'll reconnect it to bicycle/motorcycle for me even with a steering wheel.

 

[John Painter]

As a former biker were you personally attracted to the Elio because it was a narrow enclosed cabin motorcycle that looked fun to drive, because you drove a clunker and needed reliable transportation, or both?

I think the point was will motorcyclists in general or older retiring bikers, getting off motorcycles for whatever the reason, be attracted to the Elio as a viable demographic that should be marketed to or will they say "it looks like a damn scooter or something my 'old lady' would drive " as they roll on the ground with laughter.

Yes. The rise of the ATV and now UTV class has been on the backs of aging motorcyclists, in Maine the swing to ATVs has been across generations because younger people see their parents riding them. For motorcyclists like myself who are not big fans of ATV and UTV and do not see the wisdom of plunking down $20k on a Spyder or Slingshot, the Elio the hits a sweet spot. If Elio doesn't offer a roll top option, a la Citroen Ente, I know that I've seen how it's assembled I'll do it on my own eventually.

 

[CheeseheadEarl]

Yes. The rise of the ATV and now UTV class has been on the backs of aging motorcyclists

That's not how it happened in this area, ATVs grew with the generations that had them as toys as kids in the 80s, and the UTV evolution as they started aging a bit and wanted the ATV without the single climb over seat, room for kids, etc.

We could have a whole off topic conversation on this.