The Real P5 ?

[2ndrew]

Yeah I seriously doubt they will be using the P5 for anything more than what they used the P4 for. MPG tests, crash tests, whatever tests will probably be done all with E series. They'll let the journalists drive the P5 around like they did with the P4 to get more people aware and interested in the project. It will be the show/tour car.

Hopefully they get a bunch of the same people that drove the P4 to drive and write about the P5, detailing the progress that has been made.

 

[Ekh]

The P5 lis the final prototype car; the 25 E cars are engineering vehicles. At least 5 of these will be fully finished and will be used for marketing purposes.

The various body off again / on again pictures we've seen, with clamps, measuring tapes, color coding, etc have been part of the process of building a car whose measurements are close enough to final so that the E cars can be built using a more standardized process, leading in turn to the actual manufacturing process details.

As a prototype car, there will be elements of fit, finish, detailing, and a number of parts that will NOT be used in the E-cars due, among other things, to parts availability and signed contracts from suppliers. Accordingly, the P5 is not a car you can say actually represents the finished product. It's 90% of the way there, perhaps even more, but the "real deal" it ain't. Which is a good reason it's not being submitted for formal DOE / EPA testing.

My guess is that sometime in the near future they'll take the governor off and test drive the vehicle for a few hundred miles of "real world" gas mileage testing. Those results will tell them where they actually are vis a vis targets. Whether the results would ever be publicized, I don't know ... though if they're good, the temptation will be tremendous.

So there you have it: the P5 is as close to a finished car as a prototype can be, but parts variances and some engineering variances between this and the production engine make it impractical to use it for final certification.

 

[Jeff Porter]

The P5 lis the final prototype car; the 25 E cars are engineering vehicles. At least 5 of these will be fully finished and will be used for marketing purposes.

The various body off again / on again pictures we've seen, with clamps, measuring tapes, color coding, etc have been part of the process of building a car whose measurements are close enough to final so that the E cars can be built using a more standardized process, leading in turn to the actual manufacturing process details.

As a prototype car, there will be elements of fit, finish, detailing, and a number of parts that will NOT be used in the E-cars due, among other things, to parts availability and signed contracts from suppliers. Accordingly, the P5 is not a car you can say actually represents the finished product. It's 90% of the way there, perhaps even more, but the "real deal" it ain't. Which is a good reason it's not being submitted for formal DOE / EPA testing.

My guess is that sometime in the near future they'll take the governor off and test drive the vehicle for a few hundred miles of "real world" gas mileage testing. Those results will tell them where they actually are vis a vis targets. Whether the results would ever be publicized, I don't know ... though if they're good, the temptation will be tremendous.

So there you have it: the P5 is as close to a finished car as a prototype can be, but parts variances and some engineering variances between this and the production engine make it impractical to use it for final certification.

Thanks for the level-set Eric! Appreciate it very much.

It's important for everyone to tone-down your expectations a notch. It's a prototype. It's probably worth 5 to 10 times more than what it cost to build it, so no special testing will happen to it for a while. It's 90% of the way there towards being exactly like production, maybe a bit more. It will be used the same as the P4 is now.

All that said, this IS great news to confirm that they'll be in L.A. as hoped with the P5! It must be an exciting and nerve-wracking time for the folks working on the car and getting it ready to go.

 

[JEBar]

It's important for everyone to tone-down your expectations a notch. It's a prototype. It's probably worth 5 to 10 times more than what it cost to build it, so no special testing will happen to it for a while. It's 90% of the way there towards being exactly like production, maybe a bit more. It will be used the same as the P4 is now.

AMEN .... it is what it is and shortly we will know exactly what it is ....

 

[AriLea]

Is this going to be a working and legit P5? Or just the giant paper weight people were talking about that's purely for show? If they had time, maybe they should drive it out to LA. Would be a hella'va selling point.

There is only one reason to move it to the IAV shop, that would be to get/verify the engine running perfectly. So no, not a paperweight.
It would be a bit too risky to drive it out there, as nice as the PR result would be. I expect there will be a media test drive or two shortly before, during or after the show. You can bet a dozen media organizations are vying for the opportunity to be first.

 

[WilliamH]

There is only one reason to move it to the IAV shop, that would be to get/verify the engine running perfectly. So no, not a paperweight.
It would be a bit too risky to drive it out there, as nice as the PR result would be. I expect there will be a media test drive or two shortly before, during or after the show. You can bet a dozen media organizations are vying for the opportunity to be first.

If they do allow media test drives, I seriously hope Jalopnik is dead last, if at all.

 

[Muzhik]

A brand new prototype you're going to display to the world; no; I wouldn't take the chance of driving it and have some teenager that had to text her BFF about nothing hitting it.

Almost 20 years ago while driving home eastbound on the interstate, I had an experience where, within 20 minutes, I hit a deer then was rear-ended by a teenager.

When I hit the deer, the car spun around so that it was ALMOST turned around and ALMOST off the road. Lots of people stopped and (this being Iowa) asked if I was OK. The next thing they asked (this being Iowa) was, if I didn't want the deer, could they have it? About 20 minutes later enough people had gathered and the highway seemed clear enough that I decided to see if we could push the car entirely off the road. I opened the drivers door to put the car in neutral, bent down, and found myself staring into a pair of headlights heading for me at 60 miles an hour.

It's an odd sensation running for your life, knowing you won't make it. I heard an enormous bang followed by something smacking into my leg. I kept on hobbling until I knew I was far enough away. Some 16-year-old who had his license for two weeks had gotten distracted by something in the westbound set of lanes and so didn't see all the cars parked around my car. He hit my rear passenger side smack dab where the gas cap was (which I had filled up just that morning). Later insurance photos showed that the top of the gas tank had been sheared off. It was my front passenger's side that I had felt smacking into my leg as the car spun around. This collision turned what would have been an expensive but repairable deer collision into a car (which we'd had for less than a month) that was totaled.

This time of year, driving from Michigan to Vegas, it's not the texting teens you have to watch out for but the bucks playing "mount-the-doe".

BTW, which company is making the airbags for the Elio?

 

[WilliamH]

Almost 20 years ago while driving home eastbound on the interstate, I had an experience where, within 20 minutes, I hit a deer then was rear-ended by a teenager.

When I hit the deer, the car spun around so that it was ALMOST turned around and ALMOST off the road. Lots of people stopped and (this being Iowa) asked if I was OK. The next thing they asked (this being Iowa) was, if I didn't want the deer, could they have it? About 20 minutes later enough people had gathered and the highway seemed clear enough that I decided to see if we could push the car entirely off the road. I opened the drivers door to put the car in neutral, bent down, and found myself staring into a pair of headlights heading for me at 60 miles an hour.

It's an odd sensation running for your life, knowing you won't make it. I heard an enormous bang followed by something smacking into my leg. I kept on hobbling until I knew I was far enough away. Some 16-year-old who had his license for two weeks had gotten distracted by something in the westbound set of lanes and so didn't see all the cars parked around my car. He hit my rear passenger side smack dab where the gas cap was (which I had filled up just that morning). Later insurance photos showed that the top of the gas tank had been sheared off. It was my front passenger's side that I had felt smacking into my leg as the car spun around. This collision turned what would have been an expensive but repairable deer collision into a car (which we'd had for less than a month) that was totaled.

This time of year, driving from Michigan to Vegas, it's not the texting teens you have to watch out for but the bucks playing "mount-the-doe".

BTW, which company is making the airbags for the Elio?

Last anyone heard it was Takata.

 

[John Painter]

Almost 20 years ago while driving home eastbound on the interstate, I had an experience where, within 20 minutes, I hit a deer then was rear-ended by a teenager.

When I hit the deer, the car spun around so that it was ALMOST turned around and ALMOST off the road. Lots of people stopped and (this being Iowa) asked if I was OK. The next thing they asked (this being Iowa) was, if I didn't want the deer, could they have it? About 20 minutes later enough people had gathered and the highway seemed clear enough that I decided to see if we could push the car entirely off the road. I opened the drivers door to put the car in neutral, bent down, and found myself staring into a pair of headlights heading for me at 60 miles an hour.

It's an odd sensation running for your life, knowing you won't make it. I heard an enormous bang followed by something smacking into my leg. I kept on hobbling until I knew I was far enough away. Some 16-year-old who had his license for two weeks had gotten distracted by something in the westbound set of lanes and so didn't see all the cars parked around my car. He hit my rear passenger side smack dab where the gas cap was (which I had filled up just that morning). Later insurance photos showed that the top of the gas tank had been sheared off. It was my front passenger's side that I had felt smacking into my leg as the car spun around. This collision turned what would have been an expensive but repairable deer collision into a car (which we'd had for less than a month) that was totaled.

This time of year, driving from Michigan to Vegas, it's not the texting teens you have to watch out for but the bucks playing "mount-the-doe".

BTW, which company is making the airbags for the Elio?

Similar situation with deer and turkey in Maine, but much worse up north with our moose population. In this case we are lucky EM is not already in production, it's Takata.

 

[Coss]

I was hoping for the real deal, but the consensus on the forum seems to be that it won't be much more than a shell with the IAV engine. I was told not to get my expectations up.

I hope what everyone has stated this has changed your mind about being an "empty shell with an IAV".
It is much more than "an empty shell"