The Elio Automatic Transmission

[Scott Berridge]

I still have a problem understanding how the "manual" MMT Aisin transmission works vs. the "optional, more expensive" automatic. From what I have read on Aisin's website and other places, the MMT system will make the shifts, controlled by computer, for you without the need to engage a clutch pedal. That sure sounds dang close to "automatic" to me. I understand that a true automatic works differently, but just how different is the MMT vs. the true automatic?

 

[Sethodine]

I still have a problem understanding how the "manual" MMT Aisin transmission works vs. the "optional, more expensive" automatic. From what I have read on Aisin's website and other places, the MMT system will make the shifts, controlled by computer, for you without the need to engage a clutch pedal. That sure sounds dang close to "automatic" to me. I understand that a true automatic works differently, but just how different is the MMT vs. the true automatic?

The MMT is the optional, more expensive "automatic" (yeah, I was confused too). The manual option will be a traditional 5-speed with cable-operated clutch pedal, also from Aisin. I can't remember the specific model, but it's mentioned in this thread somewhere

 

[Johnny Acree]

You are confusing MMT (multi mode transmission) and manual.
The MMT is the optional (automatic) transmission.
The manual transmission is just that, a manual transmission with a clutch pedal and a gear shifter.

 

[skygazer6033]

The MMT is the optional more expensive automatic transmission. The AMT is sometimes called MMT MultiMode Manual (because that's what Toyota calls it). Your only choice is a conventional 5 speed manual and the AMT which is the same 5 speed manual with computer commanded electromechanical servos to operate the clutch and shift the gears. The AMT is more efficient than conventional hydromechanical transmissions since there is no power lost to drive a hydraulic pump or friction losses from dragging clutches and bands.

 

[skygazer6033]

The manual is the Aisin BC5 5-speed, the Automated Manual is the Aisin MC5.

 

[WilliamH]

The MMT is the optional, more expensive "automatic" (yeah, I was confused too). The manual option will be a traditional 5-speed with cable-operated clutch pedal, also from Aisin. I can't remember the specific model, but it's mentioned in this thread somewhere

The BC5 is the manual
The MC5 is the automatic.

 

[floydv]

I still have a problem understanding how the "manual" MMT Aisin transmission works vs. the "optional, more expensive" automatic. From what I have read on Aisin's website and other places, the MMT system will make the shifts, controlled by computer, for you without the need to engage a clutch pedal. That sure sounds dang close to "automatic" to me. I understand that a true automatic works differently, but just how different is the MMT vs. the true automatic?

The best way to understand how the AMT/MMT feels is to imagine yourself as the passenger in a car with a stick shift. Now imagine the driver is driving along, moving the shifter as he/she goes through the gears. That's what it feels like, and it feels like that because someone else (the driver in my example, the computer in a vehicle with an AMT/MMT) is actually shifting what is essentially a manual transmission.

 

[pistonboy]

I wanted to experience what the automated manual transmission would feel like, so I test drove a Yaris billed as having an “automatic” transmission. The transmission felt exactly like a traditional automatic transmission which made no sense to me. When placed in gear, there was the traditional slight clunk. I thought the clutch would stay unengaged until the brake was released and the accelerator depressed. There was no feel of acceleration let-up when gears were changed which also baffled me. When changing gears and the clutch is momentarily disengaged, there should be a momentary let-up of acceleration. This seemed strange to me.

I talked to a service manager and one of the mechanics. We all had a simultaneous conversation about the automatic transmission. I explained the automated manual transmission to them that was suppose to be in the Yaris, and they reassured me the automatic transmission in the Yaris is a traditional transmission, the type that uses a torque converter. This was stated by the service manager and the mechanic. This is what the transmission felt like.

I looked in Wikipedia under multimode manual transmission and it said this:

Multimode Manual Transmission (MMT or M/M, also Multimode Transmission)[1] is a type of sequential manual transmission offered by Toyota. It uses a traditional manual gearbox with an electronically controlled clutch. Multimode Manual Transmission is available in the Aygo, Yaris, Corolla, Corolla Verso and Auris in Europe, and should not be confused with Multimode Automatic Transmission, which is offered in the North American market by Toyota.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multimode_manual_transmission

Note it says: should not be confused with Multimode Automatic Transmission, which is offered in the North American market by Toyota.

Apparently it is in the Yaris world wide but not in North America. A traditional automatic transmission is used here.

In Wikipedia under List of Aisin transmissions (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Aisin_transmissions), it says the Toyota Yaris has the automated manual transmission but this must be referring to the world wide Yaris, not the North American Yaris. It also says the Suzuki Swift has this same transmission, but I bet it is the same way: the world wide Swift has this transmission but not the North American Swift. Today I went to test drive the Swift and discovered the Suzuki dealer is no longer in town. Perhaps someone else can test drive it and report back. This would be appreciated. But talk to the mechanics, not the sales person.

I doubt the automated manual transmission is in any vehicle in US. Companies probably think americans would not like it. I believe they are correct. If americans do not like the feel of the CVT, they probably would not like the feel of the acceleration letting up momentarily when changing gears. If this transmission were in the US, we would probably already be familiar with it. I have heard that Ford has something like this but I suspect it is the dual clutch type.

If this is the case, we do not have a way of trying out the transmission before we buy it. The Elio would be the first to have this type of transmission.

Is this transmission already in our country? Just because the internet says so, does not make it true. Once on the internet, information (correct or incorrect) is repeated rampantly.

 

[Coss]

On the Yaris you drove; after P R N what was the letter or number?
If it was M (or a D) and it had a + and - showing close by that would be the MMT
If it showed D 3 2 1 (or D 2 1) that is a regular automatic
If it had a P R N D with nothing lower, that could have been a CVT

 

[pistonboy]

On the Yaris you drove; after P R N what was the letter or number?
If it was M (or a D) and it had a + and - showing close by that would be the MMT
If it showed D 3 2 1 (or D 2 1) that is a regular automatic
If it had a P R N D with nothing lower, that could have been a CVT

I do not remember the letters or symbols on the shifter. But I do remember the Toyota Mechanic saying the transmission was a traditional torque converter type.