E85, Flex Fuel Engine?

[dgruis]

It's all about options. I am not a physicist, but I assume the co-efficient of drag is similar or exactly the same with all power options. Vehicle weight may change, but the aerodynamics should not.

Urban folks may want/demand an electric option. Rural folks may want/demand a gas/diesel/flex-fuel option.

Dad always told me, "Remember some people will cuss you if you walk up and give them a $5 bill, because they want a $100 bill. Some people aren't happy unless they're b*tchin'"

 

[Edward]

It's all about options. I am not a physicist, but I assume the co-efficient of drag is similar or exactly the same with all power options. Vehicle weight may change, but the aerodynamics should not.

Urban folks may want/demand an electric option. Rural folks may want/demand a gas/diesel/flex-fuel option.

Dad always told me, "Remember some people will cuss you if you walk up and give them a $5 bill, because they want a $100 bill. Some people aren't happy unless they're b*tchin'"

I agree that, in general, more options are better than/ fewer, but I'd rather see that market research shows that there are sufficient numbers wanting to buy an electric/flex fuel/ diesel/ natural gas/Flintstone drivetrain before any money is spent developing any of those systems.

 

[Lil4X]

A great advantage of the Elio's simplicity is that it will be easily adaptable to any power package - making it an essentially timeless platform for the future. When new technologies become practical and there is sufficient supporting infrastructure, the basic platform can adapt easily in newer models.

 

[dgruis]

Bottom line, I assume the current Elio goal is to produce an ultra-reliable, ultra-low price gas-powered vehicle to get the business off the ground. I doubt non-functioning business would much on market research; whereas, tossing out ideas about the flexibility of the basic platform for "future" is free. We Elio-freaks will do the word-of-mouth promotions for Elio.

smarts have not yet sold huge numbers in the U.S., but us smart-freaks keep promoting the car for Mercedes because we don't want smart to go away. After owning a smart, we all fear driving vehicles that get less than 40 mpg. If/when Elio is in production I assume my family will have Elios & smarts.

 

[TGElder]

Gasoline fuel in whatever formulation is the most proven and reliable power source. Trust me I know several Fire Fighters who have share some of the dangers of a large lead-acid battery in a collision. I don't want to be trapped in a vehicle with a battery leaking sulfuric acid all over while I wait for the firemen to cut through the battery cables before they can cut me out. Besides think of the weight. A small forklift with an electric battery, and the battery weight 1500 pounds. So much for handling and responsiveness. To quote a famous engineer, "The more they think up the plumbing the easier it is to stop up the drain."

 

[Ty]

Gasoline fuel in whatever formulation is the most proven and reliable power source. Trust me I know several Fire Fighters who have share some of the dangers of a large lead-acid battery in a collision. I don't want to be trapped in a vehicle with a battery leaking sulfuric acid all over while I wait for the firemen to cut through the battery cables before they can cut me out. Besides think of the weight. A small forklift with an electric battery, and the battery weight 1500 pounds. So much for handling and responsiveness. To quote a famous engineer, "The more they think up the plumbing the easier it is to stop up the drain."

Well said.

 

[Edward]

Bottom line, I assume the current Elio goal is to produce an ultra-reliable, ultra-low price gas-powered vehicle to get the business off the ground. I doubt non-functioning business would much on market research; whereas, tossing out ideas about the flexibility of the basic platform for "future" is free. We Elio-freaks will do the word-of-mouth promotions for Elio.

I've said before that Step 1 is getting the car as originally described in production, and worry about expanding their product line after launch. So we are on the same page there.
I'm just saying that I don't think an electric drivetrain would have as big of a market as people are predicting.

A great advantage of the Elio's simplicity is that it will be easily adaptable to any power package - making it an essentially timeless platform for the future. When new technologies become practical and there is sufficient supporting infrastructure, the basic platform can adapt easily in newer models.

Easily adaptable, yes, but there will still be time, effort, and (most importantly) money spent to pick the right motor and subassemblies for any particular type of drivetrain, testing it, etc. Elio can't just say, hey, let's give buyers an electric option and then *poof* start selling it.

 

[dgruis]

I've changed my mind, Elio MUST ONLY start producing after they have perfected a re-claimed-nuclear-waste powered engine.

A few states would PAY high $$$ to Elio owners to take the nuclear waste. Each Elio purchased would generate a $2,000,000 dollar profit, rather than a $6800 expense. Buyers would quickly die from radiation, but the planned flex-fuel option would encourage remaining family members (or ferrets) to ferment the owner's rotting carcass into ethanol and butane. Or, alcoholics could avoid creating alcohol with the rotting carcasses by burying the remains for a few million years . Then...convert into the highly proven, highly reliable, and drinkable fuel we called gasoline way-back-when.

Then...
Sweet singing sparrows would mutate from the radioactive drift to engender mutant, giant, feathered dragon-birds that breath fire. Ironically, the low drag-co-efficient would prevent the radiation from drifting too far. Radioactive drift would be most concentrated on the sparrows on roadside fences and powerlin es.

Then...
The fire breathing, mutated cardinals would be used to burn (an possibly sodomize) small-brained people who had thunk treasonous thoughts of a non-fossil-fuel based options.

Then...
Billions of observers would be sh*tting their pants from laughing so hard as they watch the mutant sparrows eat Ford & GM, hence creating an un-limited supply of methane.

So...
Elio MUST ONLY start this process after they have perfected a methane drinking gerbels that would spin on wheels to power the 2015 Elio.

I can't wait! We must all invest in gerbil futures.

 

[Farm Boy]

I've changed my mind, Elio MUST ONLY start producing after they have perfected a re-claimed-nuclear-waste powered engine.

A few states would PAY high $$$ to Elio owners to take the nuclear waste. Each Elio purchased would generate a $2,000,000 dollar profit, rather than a $6800 expense. Buyers would quickly die from radiation, but the planned flex-fuel option would encourage remaining family members (or ferrets) to ferment the owner's rotting carcass into ethanol and butane. Or, alcoholics could avoid creating alcohol with the rotting carcasses by burying the remains for a few million years . Then...convert into the highly proven, highly reliable, and drinkable fuel we called gasoline way-back-when.

Then...
Sweet singing sparrows would mutate from the radioactive drift to engender mutant, giant, feathered dragon-birds that breath fire. Ironically, the low drag-co-efficient would prevent the radiation from drifting too far. Radioactive drift would be most concentrated on the sparrows on roadside fences and powerlin es.

Then...
The fire breathing, mutated cardinals would be used to burn (an possibly sodomize) small-brained people who had thunk treasonous thoughts of a non-fossil-fuel based options.

Then...
Billions of observers would be sh*tting their pants from laughing so hard as they watch the mutant sparrows eat Ford & GM, hence creating an un-limited supply of methane.

So...
Elio MUST ONLY start this process after they have perfected a methane drinking gerbels that would spin on wheels to power the 2015 Elio.

I can't wait! We must all invest in gerbil futures.

I'll have what he is having!!!

 

[Farm Boy]

Gasoline fuel in whatever formulation is the most proven and reliable power source. Trust me I know several Fire Fighters who have share some of the dangers of a large lead-acid battery in a collision. I don't want to be trapped in a vehicle with a battery leaking sulfuric acid all over while I wait for the firemen to cut through the battery cables before they can cut me out. Besides think of the weight. A small forklift with an electric battery, and the battery weight 1500 pounds. So much for handling and responsiveness. To quote a famous engineer, "The more they think up the plumbing the easier it is to stop up the drain."

I work with electric forklifts and the ones that most people think of weighs in at 13000 pounds and the battery alone at 3800#, that’s more than a HUMMER. I like the idea of electric, but for the most part battery technology hasn’t changed much in the last 100 years and the range is to short and charge time to long to be widely utilized . With the exception of lithium ion battery’s [ask Boeing how that’s working out] there’s not much cutting edge out in the battery world at this time. I will have to agree that Elio needs to get a car out and in the hands of the public first, then start coming out with different powertrain options after a year or so.
Thanks for all your comments.