Aptera

[Ty]

If aptera managed to fit 2 standard solar panels worth of cells on that car thing, it would produce 690 Watts per hour - 5,520 in 8 hours of optimal sun while you are at work. I consumes 100 Watts per mile of travel. That would give you 55 miles of range every day it was parked outside. Shoot, with the smaller of their batteries, it'd go 400 miles between charges. Even with half the solar cells and half the industry efficiency, it would still charge up 13.8 miles per day. Heck, you'd almost never have to charge it.

Anyway, that's a lot of money for the thing in it's original form... with solar added, it'd be WAY on up there in price... probably more than the Lightyear One.

 

[AriLea]

I suspect the way to do a viable solar car is a fold-out solar array. Fold outs, of course, imply partial-day driving, which matches the commuting case. For a longer day of driving, improving distance per day, possibly a pull trailer with a fold out array, but with some cells that are full duty.

Just like battery tech, the cost would have to come down. It may-well make it one day.

 

[Ty]

I suspect the way to do a viable solar car is a fold-out solar array. Fold outs, of course, imply partial-day driving, which matches the commuting case. For a longer day of driving, improving distance per day, possibly a pull trailer with a fold out array, but with some cells that are full duty.

Just like battery tech, the cost would have to come down. It may-well make it one day.

It wouldn't take much surface area to keep the car charged if it does, in fact, only use 100 Watts of power per mile. It would seem that with a single solar panel being able to produce 345 watts of power per hour, it wouldn't take too long for a truly efficient car to recharge it's lost commute wattage. We are close. Very close.

 

[RSchneider]

It wouldn't take much surface area to keep the car charged if it does, in fact, only use 100 Watts of power per mile. It would seem that with a single solar panel being able to produce 345 watts of power per hour, it wouldn't take too long for a truly efficient car to recharge it's lost commute wattage. We are close. Very close.

Best part is, the Aptera will be 3D printed. So when they get on the road and people are going a week without plugging in, then they can change the body a bit to accept solar panels. I'd then expect the mileage will go up even more. Maybe 1500 miles.

 

[slinches]

Not to be a downer, but while the Aptera is cool and has a lot of really great technology concepts, this thing is an exercise in impractical engineering. It's hyper-efficient, but the cost of obtaining that efficiency is so high that you could buy three Elios and drive them for over 200k miles each before your cost to own even hits the >$30k MSRP of this thing. Even if it can be powered by onboard solar so there's no fuel cost at all, it still doesn't make sense economically. If you factor in the opportunity cost for paying up front, it may not break even in a lifetime of driving if it were to somehow last that long.

 

[RSchneider]

Aptera is now funded and they will be building prototypes. So folks, we will have something to see soon. I see they even crash tested it already, so that's a big bonus.

 

[Samuel Gompers]

Not to be a downer, but while the Aptera is cool and has a lot of really great technology concepts, this thing is an exercise in impractical engineering. It's hyper-efficient, but the cost of obtaining that efficiency is so high that you could buy three Elios and drive them for over 200k miles each before your cost to own even hits the >$30k MSRP of this thing. Even if it can be powered by onboard solar so there's no fuel cost at all, it still doesn't make sense economically. If you factor in the opportunity cost for paying up front, it may not break even in a lifetime of driving if it were to somehow last that long.

It's been 6 1/2 years, and no one has been able to buy a single Elio, much less three of them. According to Elio's claims, the prototypes cost between 100k & 500k. I really don't think any realistic Aptera prospect is thinking about how many Elio's he or she could buy instead of the Aptera.

It's one thing to say that the Aptera is impractical engineering, which possibly could be true. It's quite another to say that the engineering is inferior to a product that was never fully engineered, was never produced, and has no current possibility of production. Reality is about results.

 

[Ty]

The Aptera is a great exercise in efficiency. It shows that 100W per mile is possible and simple math can show how much battery is needed for that 1,000 mile range. We've seen this type of innovation time and time again. It'll hit the more expensive vehicles first like the Lightyear One which can solar charge 31-43 miles per day while sitting in the parking lot at work. Then, it'll trickle down to more mainstream vehicles. Once the solar capabilities of the Lightyear become more mainstream, refueling vehicles will be more of an exception rather than the rule.

Regular commute and park outside? Never have to take power from our infrastructure. Long drive coming up? Recharge at rest stops along the way. Takes too long? Tough... part of having an effective commute cost of zero dollars (after paying for the car, that is). Perhaps between solid state batteries that charge in just a few minutes and super capacitor regen capabilities, it'll soon become faster to charge up than fuel up. I don't think we are far from it being faster to charge than fuel already and the future will just get quicker to charge while fueling up will never be much faster than it is today.

Exciting times, these are.

 

[slinches]

It's one thing to say that the Aptera is impractical engineering, which possibly could be true. It's quite another to say that the engineering is inferior to a product that was never fully engineered, was never produced, and has no current possibility of production. Reality is about results.

You can't buy an Aptera yet either so they aren't in that different of a position, but that wasn't the point. I never said the engineering was inferior, rather the opposite. It's better engineered, but focuses on the wrong type of efficiency for the product platform. The only selling point is extreme energy efficiency that won't actually lead to a lower cost of ownership. Sure, if they can develop the Aptera and prove out some tech, that's great. I'm all for technical progress and solving engineering challenges. I just saw such excitement here for something that is so impractical while the excitement around the extreme cost efficiency and practicality of the Elio is waning and was dismayed by that dichotomy. All of the new expensive electrified composite 3D printed things get all of the attention. Where's the love for practical, cost efficient solutions that use proven technologies?

 

[RSchneider]

All of the new expensive electrified composite 3D printed things get all of the attention.

Because that's where the money is to be made and it's the future. You'd be amazed how much money is being dumped into 3D printing and all of the car manufacturers are getting in on it. Soon they will get the volume up to where they can mass produce items. I look at it as in 5 years it'll be mainstream. I even have a $200 3D printer and make all sorts of things with it. The same parts I can make today for about $1 in resin would have cost me $3K just $20 years ago and that had to be sent out with a machine that cost about $1M.

Where's the love for practical, cost efficient solutions that use proven technologies?

It already exists. In the car market it's called a Mitsubishi Mirage or Nissan Versa.