A Diesel?

[Newworld]

I've been a diesel tech for nearly 20 years, while a little diesel in the Elio would be cool, you won't see much a gain in MPG over the 84 they are shooting for out of the gas engine, if any gain at all. 84 mpg out of a simple gas engine is HUGE! The best you see anywhere else right now is what, 40s?

Now, of course if you compare cars today gas vs. diesel in them you see decent gains. But they start in the 20s and 30s on gas, of course you'll see more impressive gains with a diesel. But when you start at 49/84 with gas like the Elio, there isn't much room to improve. I could see maybe squeaking 52/89 out of a little turbo diesel, but when you factor in the added cost of the engine, turbo, CAC, piping and electrical and the fact diesel cost more that gas it wouldn't be worth it.

Your flaw is false logic.

 

[Newworld]

The VW XL1 is an interesting vehicle but it is a plug-in hybrid which is retail priced at €111,000 or about USD $148,000. Plug-in hyrbrids are rated for fuel in a completely different way and frankly the 260 MPG rating is complete BS as it even allow them to recharge the batteries during the test. Just running on the diesel engine this car does get a European rating of 120 US MPG however as I stated above these numbers are greatly inflated vs the US EPA test meaning that this car/engine combo would likely end up receiving a similar US rating to what is expected from the Elio for a lot more money and the VW XL1 is even slower to boot.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_1-litre_car

It's ok to not like diesel engines, just state it that way. The suggestion is NOT that diesels be mandatory, but OPTIONAL. One is free to choose is the only idea. And, I choose diesel.

 

[JEBar]

I've owned rigs with diesel engines, 4-cycle gasoline engines, 2-cycle gasoline engines, and one gasoline engine modified to run off of propane .... all have had advantages and disadvantages .... none are perfect .... I wouldn't want a truck like the one shown by this post with a gasoline powered motor .... I wouldn't want a diesel powered Elio .... could an Elio get better mileage with a diesel, most probably .... 200 mpg, I seriously doubt it .... as others have noted, the additional cost of the motor, additional cost per gallon of diesel fuel, its much easier to find a mechanic that can work on a gasoline motor than it is to find one that can work on a diesel

Jim

 

[zelio]

Not everyone likes a diesel engine, but the enormous fuel savings are beyond doubt very good. I have owned a Jetta wagon for 12 years and no problems. Anyone interested in a diesel engine option?

No. In my very biased and totally not humble opinion, diesel stinks, literally. I hate the smell of it and I don't usually claim to hate things. Not only that, diesel fuel is more expensive, the Elio would be more expensive and the service would be harder to find and therefore more expensive according to what I have read. To each his own, but I definitely vote no on diesel. :-) Z

 

[zelio]

It's ok to not like diesel engines, just state it that way. The suggestion is NOT that diesels be mandatory, but OPTIONAL. One is free to choose is the only idea. And, I choose diesel.

Have you really read up on the Elio and Paul Elio's ideas? This would require building 2 engines instead of one. That would mean more delay in production. Obviously you are as biased towards diesel as I am against. This vehicle is Paul Elio's. If it had been designed with a Diesel engine I would not be looking at it because at my income I would not be able to afford it. :-) Z

 

[Truett Collins]

No. In my very biased and totally not humble opinion, diesel stinks, literally. I hate the smell of it and I don't usually claim to hate things. Not only that, diesel fuel is more expensive, the Elio would be more expensive and the service would be harder to find and therefore more expensive according to what I have read. To each his own, but I definitely vote no on diesel. Z

Then there are people like my wife who if they get around diesel or diesel fumes go into a breathing attack and have to be hospitalized or at the least a shot to counteract the attack.

 

[JEBar]

as already stated, I wouldn't want a diesel motor in an Elio type vehicle .... that said, I do have to come to the defense of the current generation of diesel engines .... one can mess with the computer and create one that will belch black smoke like there is no tomorrow but when properly tuned, they don't put off the fumes (stink) of earlier generations

Jim

 

[ross]

I've been a diesel tech for nearly 20 years, while a little diesel in the Elio would be cool, you won't see much a gain in MPG over the 84 they are shooting for out of the gas engine, if any gain at all. 84 mpg out of a simple gas engine is HUGE! The best you see anywhere else right now is what, 40s?

Now, of course if you compare cars today gas vs. diesel in them you see decent gains. But they start in the 20s and 30s on gas, of course you'll see more impressive gains with a diesel. But when you start at 49/84 with gas like the Elio, there isn't much room to improve. I could see maybe squeaking 52/89 out of a little turbo diesel, but when you factor in the added cost of the engine, turbo, CAC, piping and electrical and the fact diesel cost more that gas it wouldn't be worth it.

Keep in mind how much more energy there is in a gallon of diesel over a gallon of gas and how little torque it will take to move such a light car and how little horsepower it will take to keep such a slippery little car moving and your onto something. What I would love to see is a turbocharged direct injected gas engine. Jack the compression ratio put a turbo on it. That's down the road. First get it into production and let the hot rodders have at it

 

[Snick]

It seems many assume 120 mpg is the common denominator for determining mileage/dollar/motor value. Wrong. A car that supposedly costs $6800 could recoup it's cost far faster if 200 mpg were possible. Current turbo diesel 3 cylinder engines, with aerodynamics, change the equation dramatically. I have exceeded 54 mpg in a VW Jetta (2003 4 cylinders at twice the weight). Ultimately, the issue is a matter of choice: either one loves or hates the diesel, but its economy can not be disputed. Otherwise, millions of Europeans are somehow ignorant and wrong; which I seriously doubt. I love diesel engines and should the need ever arrive, biodiesel could be substituted for fuel in a crisis, which can never be said for gasoline.

You're forgetting how Europe taxes gasoline more than diesel, where here it's opposite. And diesel powerplants (owned a 2002 Jetta Tdi and a a 99.5 Jetta Tdi, myself) may have better FUEL economy, but worse COST OF OWNERSHIP.

There was a golden age of diesel passenger cars in North America from 2001-2007, but it has been legislated and priced out of existence.

 

[Snick]

Keep in mind how much more energy there is in a gallon of diesel over a gallon of gas and how little torque it will take to move such a light car and how little horsepower it will take to keep such a slippery little car moving and your onto something. What I would love to see is a turbocharged direct injected gas engine. Jack the compression ratio put a turbo on it. That's down the road. First get it into production and let the hot rodders have at it

Diesel fuel only has 7.5% more btu's per gallon than gasoline, on average.

I'll also take the GTDI, please!