Paul Elio Speaks! 05-11-18

[Thomas Malkin]

You need people from both sides to learn. Fox will never convert Democrats and CNN will not convert Republicans. Preaching to the choir does not accomplish anything. You do not have to agree with opposing view points, but to dismiss them blindly is foolish. People are negative and positive about Elio for a reason.

Reason has little to do with this, sadly.

 

[Thomas Malkin]

His statements aren't really much different than in the past though. Still no funding coming in. Until funding, production doesn't start. Elio throwing out dates is like someone crying wolf. This happens every year or 2.

For cripes, sake, there is no mystery here. They can't get the ATVM people to budge on the two billion in cash they have to lend. The loan board think they are caretakers of a capital fund rather than tech enablers. Elio is operating on literally no cash, and this is the last chance.

 

[Thomas Malkin]

I worked in credit for a billion dollar company and the DUNS number greatly influenced how much credit we gave or didn't give to a company. When I say I worked in credit, it was mainly my manager and I, so I actually had some say. Iirc, there was a certain threshold and if they were under that, we would make them prepay. Every once in a while, there would be a company that actually had lots of revenue, but a poor DUNS number.....but again, they had lots of money coming in and we never had issues with those companies.

Like you said, It's roughly their credit score. Say someone that didn't have a job and had a 200 credit score came to you asking for a loan, what would you tell them?....Exactly. That's exactly what credit is.....a loan.

Oddly, the broke person needs the loan most. Which metaphor applies quite perfectly to how the ATVM loans were distributed. And out of all the rich loan recipients, only Tesla paid their loan back. Ford has over 20 billion in cash, and they haven't paid their ATVM loan back - nor have they made the small electric cars they were supposed to make with that loan, a little fact people never seem to recall. Ford is making money off that loan balance, and has done nothing. Take it from Ford and give it to Elio, who will actually make a darned car.

 

[Sega]

For cripes, sake, there is no mystery here. They can't get the ATVM people to budge on the two billion in cash they have to lend. The loan board think they are caretakers of a capital fund rather than tech enablers. Elio is operating on literally no cash, and this is the last chance.

Look at my post where I posted a link to the ATVM loan. They DID NOT QUALIFY FOR THE LOAN EVEN IF THEY CROSSED ALL THEIR Ts AND DOTTED THEIR Is.

 

[Sega]

Oddly, the broke person needs the loan most. Which metaphor applies quite perfectly to how the ATVM loans were distributed. And out of all the rich loan recipients, only Tesla paid their loan back. Ford has over 20 billion in cash, and they haven't paid their ATVM loan back - nor have they made the small electric cars they were supposed to make with that loan, a little fact people never seem to recall. Ford is making money off that loan balance, and has done nothing. Take it from Ford and give it to Elio, who will actually make a darned car.

Ford has been paying on the loan. You do not give a loan and get frustrated if the person/company doesn't pay it off early. Also, they gave the loan to a company that is expected to pay it off. It is safer to give a loan to a company or person that is bringing in money than to one that isn't.

Here is what they have done with the money according to energy.gov...... https://www.energy.gov/lpo/ford

 

[Rob Croson]

And out of all the rich loan recipients, only Tesla paid their loan back.

While it is true that Tesla paid them back early, the reason they did so was purely profit motivated on Tesla's part. If they hadn't, then certain parties were going to get their hands on HUGE amounts of Tesla stock at absurdly discounted prices.

Ford has over 20 billion in cash, and they haven't paid their ATVM loan back

Ford is paying back the loan as agreed, and on schedule.

nor have they made the small electric cars they were supposed to make with that loan, a little fact people never seem to recall.

People don't recall those because THAT'S NOT TRUE! More inaccurate, and blatantly false information. Ford's loan was NOT for making electric cars. The ATVM program was NOT a program that was exclusive to electric cars, nor anything explicitly for small cars. Ford was required to list, in detail, exactly what they were going to do with the money, and then do that with it, with stict reporting standards to ensure that they really did. Ford got their loan to modernize manufacturing methods, and improve the fuel economy of those engines. Which they did.

Ford went to the ATVM with a detailed plan for what to do with the money. The ATVM folks bought off on that plan, and started doling out the cash. Ford then went out did exactly what they said they were going to do, which is why the ATVM people kept giving them the money. Then Ford started paying the loan back, exactly on plan. Both sides of the agreement did eactly what they said they were going to do, according to the terms paid out for, and by, both of them. The fact that those terms weren't the ones you fantasize them to be is your problem.

 

[Ty]

Oddly, the broke person needs the loan most. Which metaphor applies quite perfectly to how the ATVM loans were distributed. And out of all the rich loan recipients, only Tesla paid their loan back. Ford has over 20 billion in cash, and they haven't paid their ATVM loan back - nor have they made the small electric cars they were supposed to make with that loan, a little fact people never seem to recall. Ford is making money off that loan balance, and has done nothing. Take it from Ford and give it to Elio, who will actually make a darned car.

Actually, Ford didn't take the ATVM loan to build cars:

In September 2009, the Department of Energy issued a $5.9 billion loan to the Ford Motor Company to upgrade 13 facilities in Illinois, Kentucky, Michigan, Missouri, New York, and Ohio.

Ford has manufactured vehicles at ATVM-supported facilities that are expected to save 268,000,000 gallons of gasoline and prevent 2,380,000 metric tons of carbon dioxide emissions each year.

Both facts are from : https://www.energy.gov/lpo/ford

Ford's loan isn't due until 2022. They are on schedule and it wouldn't make much sense to pay off a direct loan ahead of schedule. Tesla's and Nissan's loans were significantly lower and affected fewer projects and people.

Facts are fun.

 

[RSchneider]

Ford has been paying on the loan. You do not give a loan and get frustrated if the person/company doesn't pay it off early. Also, they gave the loan to a company that is expected to pay it off. It is safer to give a loan to a company or person that is bringing in money than to one that isn't.

Here is what they have done with the money according to energy.gov...... https://www.energy.gov/lpo/ford

I'm in a similar situation. I have 4 investment properties, thus 4 mortgages. I could take all of my stocks cash them in and use up all my savings to pay them off today. I seriously doubt the bank will start handing out loans to the poor because I did that. The bank has plenty of money to loan and it really doesn't make any difference to the people that need the money if I pay off early or just pay to what I agreed to do. What i am doing is watching the performance of my investments vs my loans. Right now it make no sense for me to pay off the loans. I do this because I want to make money as opposed to just leaving it on the table for someone else to make.

As for the ATVM loan, Tesla paid it off 9 years early but did that allow someone else to get a loan? Nope. The DoE had more than enough to loan out money and Tesla paying it back early was just a drop in the bucket.

 

[pistonboy]

$2.5M was cash for stock. So, Overstock owns 4% of Elio Motors now.



It's 76 weeks plus a few. Then Elio will be building cars. I never heard Elio talk about waiting for the Eliocoin STO to get the 76 weeks plus a few to commence. So, I don't know what "a few" means as it could be 3 weeks or 5 weeks. That "few" weeks is to dust off the project to get it back up and running. From reading between the lines, the money from the STO is already there and they "Elio" are full steam ahead with no financial delays at all. Jones trading seems to have taken care of getting that funding.

If 4% of Elio Motors is worth $2,500,000, then the entire Elio Motors company is only worth $62,500,000.

 

[Sega]

I'm in a similar situation. I have 4 investment properties, thus 4 mortgages. I could take all of my stocks cash them in and use up all my savings to pay them off today. I seriously doubt the bank will start handing out loans to the poor because I did that. The bank has plenty of money to loan and it really doesn't make any difference to the people that need the money if I pay off early or just pay to what I agreed to do. What i am doing is watching the performance of my investments vs my loans. Right now it make no sense for me to pay off the loans. I do this because I want to make money as opposed to just leaving it on the table for someone else to make.

As for the ATVM loan, Tesla paid it off 9 years early but did that allow someone else to get a loan? Nope. The DoE had more than enough to loan out money and Tesla paying it back early was just a drop in the bucket.

I agree. That's the problem is people don't understand how companies look at loans. Just because you have the ability to pay something off doesn't mean you should always do it. Why would you use all your savings to pay off a 5% loan when you could invest your savings and get a 20% return on it?....or why use up all your savings, be cash strapped and then have an issue come up where you need money?