Nothing to feel bad about..... Reality is not Elio's strongest suit!
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My Elio Alternate Project Is Underway.
- Thread starter Mark BEX
- Start date
Yes, have an interest solution that I don't believe has been used by anyone before, yet works well for other industries.
Thanks to all for the well wishes with my current issues, in forums, and I have been since 1999, I find Americans to be mostly respectful, helpful, and polite, more so than most other Nationalities.
84mpg
Elio Addict
"I find Americans to be mostly respectful, helpful, and polite, more so than most other Nationalities."
Only on our good days!
We're all looking forward to the interest solution!
"I find Americans to be mostly respectful, helpful, and polite, more so than most other Nationalities."
Only on our good days!
Ha! The English are the worst if you're wondering, that I have found anyway.
RSchneider
Elio Addict
It's just an observation as to what both sides have said. Think about how much more Elio was going to offer:
- 65K units the first year
- 125K-250K per year afterwards
- 120 stores
- Highly customizable vehicle
- Training for the Pep Boys mechanics
- Warranty operations
- Parts warehouse and distribution
- ABS, TC and Stability control
- Airbags
- Exporting to China by the end of the last decade
That's just a few things. Once Elio decided to start taking reservations and then fixing the price for certain reservationists, that's where they poisoned the well. Top it off it took over 4 years just to get 65K reservations. That showed me and investors, the numbers that Elio was quoting for production numbers, was blown way out of proportion for the market.
What Elio should have done is look at Vanderhall. They actually make three wheelers, have dealers and service all over the US. Yes, it's way too expensive for anyone here but people have bought them (I'm the only one here that actually went to a local dealer and test drove one, plus they let you do it for free). Elio could have had a $30K unit and made a few hundred the first year and maybe 500-800 per year for the next 5 years and then use those profits to make a cheaper version. They could have done it through the same types of dealers that Vanderhall uses (motorcycle and powersports dealers). Once you have the infrastructure built up, then you can expand the offerings and go cheaper (i.e. Tesla).
I hope people here are seeing how you are starting small, gauging a real interest in a product, then moving forward to meet that market. All in hopes that it will take off and you see growth year after year. The same can be said for Arcimoto. The product is trickling out of the factory and they have a limited sales area (they won't sell me one, unless I move). They are hoping that the market will grow but knew that they couldn't have been gunning for 25K units in a year or two after the first one rolled off the line.
I offer what I know I am able to supply, there's your difference.
I have always had a problem with telling the truth in business, in that I tell the truth
Nice writeup, appreciate your effort.
I agree on # 2 but not #1 and 3. The only thing he was able to prove is that the 65+ reservation holders are willing to pay the UNREALISTIC PRICE" of $6800.00 that's laughable by investor's standards. And # 3, not a single ELIO was sold and not a single production prototype was validated as "commuter safe" by any Gov't agency or 3rd party testers like Car & Driver, Motor Trend, etc.
RSchneider
Elio Addict
You are incorrect on #1. It took 52 months for Elio to get 65K reservations. As I have covered before, most were $100 deposits, thus not a glowing vote of confidence for the productions numbers Elio needed. Less than 22K people signed up for a $7K price tag and certified that they were actually going to buy it. Again, not a confidence booster. If Elio had 65K reservations the first month, then investors would have seen a different picture.
#2 was a big mistake for them. Instead of paying lobbyist money to change these laws, they should have started selling the product in limited numbers and then go to Vanderhall and Polaris and said, "How about we all go in together and get these laws changed, so we can all sell more product?" Yet Elio paid 100% of the bill. I do not believe the helmet law change was needed for Elio to get off the ground but was really needed for down the road.
#3 was something Elio was going to do but they never crash tested and the simulations were done on the tube frame chassis. So it was going to all have to be proven all over again with a completely new chassis.
We all know why people make three wheelers. It's to not have to deal with car safety and car emissions. It's a cheaper route to go. Yes, if Elio was going to hit their production numbers, then the IIHS would buy a few and destroy them. After that, rates would adjust accordingly and especially if people used them as commuters as opposed to weekend play toys (like the Vanderhall and Slingshot).
To bring this back to the BEX and on topic, that's why it's affordable for it to be made. Boutique volume for a vehicle is off the radar for the insurance industry and goverment. This way, the BEX will get out there and the real world testing begins. If it turns out to be a hit, then the next BEX will have to include the safety and emissions that will be required as it will be well known. This is why you do like the BEX and not Elio. Start off small and grow. Paul wanted the whole enchilada right now, Mark just wants a bite and leave the rest for later.
1/ I believe 18,000 depositors paid the $1,000 option? That's pretty good numbers for a low volume manufacturer, gee whiz, what I could do with that cash .... but I don't think people want to take a chance on a double whammy :-)
2/ I don't agree. I feel it was imperative for Elio to have a bespoke Autocycle class in order to get the large orders through clarification of what it is. If you had to wear a helmet, I doubt Elio would have gotten 30% of the orders he got, so I would rate that as his major coupe. A cynical person might suggest it was all part of the plan to get more money into his own pocket ...
3/ Sure, I don't want to afford the cost of crash testing, and neither do the customers want it tacked on to the end price either. I do have decades of race car prep experience and safety cage building, I believe I have demonstrated that I do care about roll over protection and side impact strength, the doors will be OEM from a car that has the legal side impact requirements built in and proven in crash testing.
But there is more than just crash testing, a car that dynamically drives better, has good forward and sideways vision, comfortable driving position, etc is always going to be a safer car due to the ability to avoid accidents.
And of course, people still choose motorcycles, an Autocycle is always going to be massive step up in safety over a motorcycle.