Arcimoto

[Rickb]

After they pay debts, back wages and get underway again, they'll have nothing again, it's a vicious cycle.

Tell them to send me a million, and I'll redesign their inefficient design, and set them up a supply chain reducing their costs 20 fold.

Here's an example: There is ABSOLUTELY ZERO REASON they didn't use lower control arms, spindles, brakes, struts from any common small car.

But no, this is their ridiculous, over engineered for no purpose, expensive, difficult to manufacturer front suspension, that also requires their ridiculous, over engineered for no purpose, expensive, difficult to manufacturer, multi-hard point front chassis subframe

View attachment 26333 < this versus this > View attachment 26335

If I took over that company, the first thing I would do is fire the people, no wait, the MORONS who are responsible for that front suspension. This is surplus money, "kids in candy store", wasteful, money pit, useless engineering at it's worst. I can't say enough negative things about this utterly ridiculous design relative to it's application, and then I could move on to all the other idiotic bespoke design points on it .... and they are bleeding money, gee, I wonder why ...

I hope they survive for a bit longer, the market needs a few there to establish the market, Arcimoto going under actually isn't in my best interest, but it's no one's fault other than their own guiding hands for the swill they are currently in.

What’s that comparison photo? Morons? Personally I think Jim Jordan, Mechanical Engineer nailed the front suspension. I found the higher profile FUV to be extremely stabile and responsive with it’s handlebar steering……a blast to drive. I can’t be critical of the vehicle itself, other than the full door option currently unavailable. Regarding off the shelf parts, they are apparently using many throughout their vehicle. It seems Arcimoto has better access and control (availability and quality) over the parts they fabricate in-house over parts from their off the shelf parts suppliers. Also, the shelves can be bare.

 

[Sonoran Sam]

This is a front end part?? It looks more like a piece of abstract art or someone playing with their bubble gum. It also looks very difficult to manufacture and costly.

 

[3wheelin]

This is a front end part?? It looks more like a piece of abstract art or someone playing with their bubble gum. It also looks very difficult to manufacture and costly.
View attachment 26339

.......or an Alien, the Blob, a pink looking toxic octopussy??? It's obvious the engineers didn't adhere to the KISS mantra and no guidelines on the budget. In all fairness, I didn't see the same contraption in the video posted by Rickb. (post# 1,622).

 

[Rickb]

This is a front end part?? It looks more like a piece of abstract art or someone playing with their bubble gum. It also looks very difficult to manufacture and costly.
View attachment 26339

.......or an Alien, the Blob, a pink looking toxic octopussy??? It's obvious the engineers didn't adhere to the KISS mantra and no guidelines on the budget. In all fairness, I didn't see the same contraption in the video posted by Rickb. (post# 1,622).

No it’s not the production FUV front end part! Why critique Arcimoto’s engineering, if you are totally unaware of the specs. What’s the point? The single light weight pink part could replace BEX’s recommended 3 parts In the future. A private companies engineering study to lighten the FUV’s weight. The video link explains the bubble gum colored parts, if interested. I‘ll leave the Arcimoto and BEX debate at this point.

 

[Rickb]

.......or an Alien, the Blob, a pink looking toxic octopussy??? It's obvious the engineers didn't adhere to the KISS mantra and no guidelines on the budget. In all fairness, I didn't see the same contraption in the video posted by Rickb. (post# 1,622).

It’s engineering to the max - the Ultimate KISS! A single part replaces multiple parts and lightens the weight of the vehicle. Also, saves money in terms of increasing manufacturing efficiency. I’m positive if ever used, the production part would be black or gun metal grey………wait a minute a brightly colored custom option.

 

[Mark BEX]

I didn't see the same contraption in the video posted by Rickb. (post# 1,622).

Wouldn't know, I've now blocked his posts, and I am past accepting his apology stance for a company that has swallowed $166 million of investors money, something that seems to be forgotten in all this, along with constantly telling me how I'm going to run my business in every post in the BEX thread, gets on your nerves after a while.

Also note the CEO was paid $300,000 in 2021 (the Def 14a I am reading), along with costs, as well as probably selling off his shares at critical moments (wonder if he's related to Paul Elio at all?), all for running a money pit, while people can't even get their doors they have paid for.

I think I should stop now.

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Yes it looks like they have simplified the ridiculous top arm, but I'll stand by my post, all of it is absolute unnecessarily complicated, a waste of time and money.

People need to understand when you have bespoke parts like this, that you need to make them in bulk, either make them yourself or from a contractor, and store them, more factory space, all meaning more time and money.

And when the owner has an accident, they can only buy the bespoke part from Arcimoto, and what's going to happen to those part's supply if Arcimoto goes under ... and what's the first thing that's going to be damaged in an accident ... yup, the front suspension.

 

[RSchneider]

Wouldn't know, I've now blocked his posts, and I am past accepting his apology stance for a company that has swallowed $166 million of investors money, something that seems to be forgotten in all this, along with constantly telling me how I'm going to run my business in every post in the BEX thread, gets on your nerves after a while.

Also note the CEO was paid $300,000 in 2021 (the Def 14a I am reading), along with costs, as well as probably selling off his shares at critical moments (wonder if he's related to Paul Elio at all?), all for running a money pit, while people can't even get their doors they have paid for.

I think I should stop now.

--------

Yes it looks like they have simplified the ridiculous top arm, but I'll stand by my post, all of it is absolute unnecessarily complicated, a waste of time and money.

People need to understand when you have bespoke parts like this, that you need to make them in bulk, either make them yourself or from a contractor, and store them, more factory space, all meaning more time and money.

And when the owner has an accident, they can only buy the bespoke part from Arcimoto, and what's going to happen to those part's supply if Arcimoto goes under ... and what's the first thing that's going to be damaged in an accident ... yup, the front suspension.

View attachment 26344

With that pink part, this was a perfect example of Mark wasting the money he won from the lottery (aka IPO). I like bleeding edge technology but I also know that when building a cheap consumer product, then you go more basic in your approach. Basic means, easy to manufacture and durable. Instead Mark wrote that company a big check and they went to work. If you think companies like that work for free, then you are mistaken. Not just the money but the engineering resources at Arcimoto were needed for this pet project. Instead, they could have devoted this to making things like full doors.

As for the front suspension, all Arcimoto had to do is buy something like a Polaris Ranger, take it apart and then ask themselves, why would an established company put McPherson front suspension on it? Then ask themselves, why did they put a steering wheel on it? Then ask themselves, why do they offer a number of door options for it (even up to ones with power windows)? Finally, why do they make them (plus the slingshot) in Huntsville, AL as opposed to Eugene, OR?

The front suspension was a major problem for Elio too. It was overly complex and if we all remember, when Roush got involved, they did the best they could. It was run of the mill stamped steel parts, welded together. Even at that, way too many parts, thus costs too much to make.

Also, that video from 2017 that showed the suspension, shows that they were not even close to what they have today. Plus from what I see, way too many adjustments, thus more parts for the suspension. The automotive industry can make cars today with one adjustment, that's front toe. Everything else is not needed due to the manufacturing tolerances. Less adjustments, less parts and quicker manufacturing. All makes for a cheaper to produce product.

 

[RSchneider]

For anyone that gets the Arcimoto newsletters, they came out with a new one. They in fact paused production but did it because of the 2023 model. The 2023 model will have new features, improving overall ride quality, performance and polish. I guess with the $12M check they got, they can now start production back up as soon as the 2023 tooling and procedures are done. It'll be interesting to hear about these changes in detail. Plus they have new and used ones available. Just give them a $500 nonrefundable deposit and they will get back to you. I assume you will only be able to get it if you live in one of the 13 states. I do but still need to test drive one before I make the purchase.

 

[Mark BEX]

They in fact paused production but did it because of the 2023 model. The 2023 model will have new features, improving overall ride quality, performance and polish.

Sounds much like a spin to me, been around long enough to not need those changes, how about supplying the back log of 'paid for' doors ...

I guess with the $12M check they got, they can now start production back up as soon as the 2023 tooling and procedures are done.

I admit I don't understand their jargon, but seems to have to pay a few people out of that, and I guess bring some of the workforce back?

"We intend to use the net proceeds from the offering to repay the convertible note with 3i, LP and the remainder of the proceeds for working capital and general corporate purposes. The convertible note with 3i, LP has a maturity date of August 31, 2024 and an interest rate of six percent (6%)"

And shirley they have current outstanding interest to pay?.

Plus they have new and used ones available.

Apparently "5 new and 1 used" in stock ... Not sure that $100K is a big difference in the greater scheme of things.

I don't understand how they can go so far down, and the same management is still retained in place, but that is certainly not a new or unique thing in corporate business.

 

[Rickb]

With that pink part, this was a perfect example of Mark wasting the money he won from the lottery (aka IPO). I like bleeding edge technology but I also know that when building a cheap consumer product, then you go more basic in your approach. Basic means, easy to manufacture and durable. Instead Mark wrote that company a big check and they went to work. If you think companies like that work for free, then you are mistaken. Not just the money but the engineering resources at Arcimoto were needed for this pet project. Instead, they could have devoted this to making things like full doors.

As for the front suspension, all Arcimoto had to do is buy something like a Polaris Ranger, take it apart and then ask themselves, why would an established company put McPherson front suspension on it? Then ask themselves, why did they put a steering wheel on it? Then ask themselves, why do they offer a number of door options for it (even up to ones with power windows)? Finally, why do they make them (plus the slingshot) in Huntsville, AL as opposed to Eugene, OR?

The front suspension was a major problem for Elio too. It was overly complex and if we all remember, when Roush got involved, they did the best they could. It was run of the mill stamped steel parts, welded together. Even at that, way too many parts, thus costs too much to make.

Also, that video from 2017 that showed the suspension, shows that they were not even close to what they have today. Plus from what I see, way too many adjustments, thus more parts for the suspension. The automotive industry can make cars today with one adjustment, that's front toe. Everything else is not needed due to the manufacturing tolerances. Less adjustments, less parts and quicker manufacturing. All makes for a cheaper to produce product.

The CEO of Xpotentialworks test drove the FUV……was impressed by the vehicle………contacted Frohnmayer about 3D printing parts to reduce weight of the vehicle. No cost to arcimoto that I’m aware of. Frankly, even with cost, a decision made to improved the production FUV, fewer parts, and money saved on manufacturing seems like a good CEO judgement call. I‘m happy with the performance and stability the engineering provides on the FUV. If you test drive the FUV, and the Vanderhallish open air ride works for you, you will have a smile on your face during the ride and possibly buy one providing sales and more importantly customer service expands to your State.