Metal...body?

[Ekh]

A four door Christine!

I drove one of those briefly -- the gears were buttons set into the steering wheel hub. The thing was a tank. OK for snow, though, for a rear wheel drive car. But it was also a piece of junk -- huge, wasted space, clunky, terrible suspension, worse brakes ...hated it.

 

[Elio Amazed]

A four door Christine!

Chris maybe. Blue has traditionally been a male designation color.

I recall those push buttons... I think my grandfather had a red and white one.

 

[pistonboy]

Robots of the Shreveport plant are already designed to weld metal parts together, forming the unibody. Could they be adapted to gluing SMC panels simply by changing the heads on them? It looks like it would be much more complicated than that.

Because the Shreveport plant was already designed to weld metal parts together, was this the major factor in deciding to go all-metal?

 

[electroken]

Robots of the Shreveport plant are already designed to weld metal parts together, forming the unibody. Could they be adapted to gluing SMC panels simply by changing the heads on them? It looks like it would be much more complicated than that.

Because the Shreveport plant was already designed to weld metal parts together, was this the major factor in deciding to go all-metal?

The Shreveport plant already had adhesive application robots for building the doors, hoods, and rear gates.

 

[outsydthebox]

Robots of the Shreveport plant are already designed to weld metal parts together, forming the unibody. Could they be adapted to gluing SMC panels simply by changing the heads on them? It looks like it would be much more complicated than that.

Because the Shreveport plant was already designed to weld metal parts together, was this the major factor in deciding to go all-metal?

I believe that a majority of the welding will be "spot welding" which (iirc) can be done without removing (burning away) the galvanized coating.
I think their decision was based on every variation they could think of...including (long-term) environmental impact, durability(adhesive vs mechanical fasteners), "recycle-ability", cost difference, labor, etc, etc...

 

[Elio Amazed]

I believe that a majority of the welding will be "spot welding" which (iirc) can be done without removing (burning away) the galvanized coating.
I think their decision was based on every variation they could think of...including (long-term) environmental impact, durability(adhesive vs mechanical fasteners), "recycle-ability", cost difference, labor, etc, etc...

I did quite a bit of spot welding, both robotic and hand-held on a "pincer" set up.
Though it's not quite as bad as a full bead, it still opens the area up to further oxidation.

 

[Ty]

I believe that a majority of the welding will be "spot welding" which (iirc) can be done without removing (burning away) the galvanized coating.
I think their decision was based on every variation they could think of...including (long-term) environmental impact, durability(adhesive vs mechanical fasteners), "recycle-ability", cost difference, labor, etc, etc...

I would like to think their decision was some grand thing like that but I feel that the conversation went like this:

Paul: So, we need to have 500 body parts a day
SMC guy: I can get you a SMC machine that can make 1 per every 30 minutes. You'll only need 35 machines and operators to keep up with demand.
Paul: 35 machines isn't bad. We can hire enough people to work those. No problem.
SMC guy: Per panel... times about 14 panels...
Paul: Oh... So... hmm...
Sheet Metal Guy (SMG): I have a machine that can stamp out parts at one per every 10 seconds. You'll need 15 machines total to stamp out the body.
Paul: Hmm. So. Is it environmentally friendly?
SMG: Well, it ISN"T un-environmentally friendly.
Paul: So, since it's metal, I wouldn't need to glue in attach points, right?
SMG: No. We can simply spot weld what you need. It'll take seconds and it's stronger than plastic.
Paul: SMC guy, So, how long will the adhesive take to set.
SMC guy: Um... Not very long at all.
Paul: So um, that's too long!
SMG: You don't have to glue sheet metal. And, it's pretty much the same price.
Paul: Faster, fewer people needed, fewer machines needed, environmentally friendly...
SMC guy: He didn't say it was environment..
Paul: Shush! How heavy is it?
SMG: Since you don't have to glue it or add supports, it can actually be lighter.
SMC guy: Screw you guys, I'm going home.
Paul: So, Get marketing on the phone, STAT!

 

[Trusting]

I have to say, I'm impressed with how many forum members seem to know their way around the auto manufacturing business. Very impressive !

 

[Johnny Acree]

This thread seems to have the most discussion about rust. So let me just say,
I want one of these!
http://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/enth...ol-makes-rust-disappear/ar-AAigDMT?li=BBnb4R5

 

[Eliodude]

There are intermediate stamping dies available that are not built from the same steel as the factory dies and so are a ton less costly. They are somewhat softer, and as I recall, are good for about 50,000 copies before they lose definition and precision and must be replaced.

I'd be willing to bet that Elio has ordered those temporary dies. Since the entire car is done in cad/cam programs, doing take-offs to have the dies made is only a matter of sending the body specs to the die maker, who takes it from there. It's all computer-controlled, and does not, I understand, take terribly long to do. How long, I don't know -- I'm not any kind of expert in tool and die making. But I'm absolutely certain Elio has these under way right now.

You're correct!

When the production equipment doesn't exist yet, you order temporary dies.

Rather than installing them in a mechanical press that can easily produce 60 parts per minute, you usually put them in a hydraulic press that stamps the parts out slowly, and one at a time.

But the die has to exist in order to make the part, and there's a fair bit of design work that has to go into each one, and it's pretty normal to have to tweak the tooling to reflect reality to get the final part dimensions correct. It is no small chore, and every production vehicle has to go through this for every single stamping.

This is an expensive undertaking, and might quickly drain Elio's limited supply of cash reserve's.