Funding Refused By Paul Elio

[Elio Amazed]

Would it not be a better decision to keep on working, earn the $100, save the cost of driving, thus eliminate the cost of your place in line to buy a ticket with the money you saved? Or do you work for minimum wage and math was not your best subject?

"Or do you work for minimum wage and math was not your best subject?"...

That's totally out of bounds man.
Is it your intention to further insult people that you know nothing about on this site?
If so, do me a favor, man up, and state that purpose now...

In order to give the moderators a quick solution to what is otherwise a usually long process.

To answer the question without entertaining the implications you've attached to it...

What you think a "better decision" is has nothing what-so-ever to do with your premise...
That a large amount of 'working age' people never attend Elio events because they all think like you do.

It may be for some, but the human nature I've seen in my lifetime...
Tells me it's not what many would consider to be a "better decision" that they would act upon.

My math is so frickin' good that...
Remember the guy that used to go on talk shows and compete against a person with a calculator by adding #s in his head?
Being fairly good at math, the first time I saw this guy on a show, I thought it would be fun to give it a shot and play along.

I beat them both.

Have YOU ever heard of paid sick days and paid personal days?
Did you know that they're quite common?

 

[Reid3400]

You are 100% correct. Never heard of paid personal days. Yes, to paid "professional development days" for school teachers, which is just a union euphemism for a 4 day holiday weekend, always on a Friday to go with the government mandated Monday holiday. Never took a paid sick day in my life, unless I was sick. I am in the wrong generation, not born into the one of entitlement. Sorry you take offense to the suggestion of how I would manage my finances and rationalize donating $100 for a good cause, while getting in line to see if there is anything in the sack ("T" shirt I just bought)?
In the past 2 years, I have actually gone from wanting an Elio, to thinking it will never happen, to in the last 30 days thinking it has a 60% chance of happening by late 2016. Every trip I take in our $5800 Miata, which we purchased over 10 years ago, I think of what fun an Elio might be. I wonder if it will corner as well and be as idiot proof? Will an Elio under-steer or over-steer? How will the handling change from driver, to driver/passenger and baggage? My ride in a T-REX was not a comforting experience because of the rear wheel drive. I hope the Elio is a totally different handling vehicle.

 

[Rickb]

You are 100% correct. Never heard of paid personal days. Yes, to paid "professional development days" for school teachers, which is just a union euphemism for a 4 day holiday weekend, always on a Friday to go with the government mandated Monday holiday. Never took a paid sick day in my life, unless I was sick. I am in the wrong generation, not born into the one of entitlement. Sorry you take offense to the suggestion of how I would manage my finances and rationalize donating $100 for a good cause, while getting in line to see if there is anything in the sack ("T" shirt I just bought)?
In the past 2 years, I have actually gone from wanting an Elio, to thinking it will never happen, to in the last 30 days thinking it has a 60% chance of happening by late 2016. Every trip I take in our $5800 Miata, which we purchased over 10 years ago, I think of what fun an Elio might be. I wonder if it will corner as well and be as idiot proof? Will an Elio under-steer or over-steer? How will the handling change from driver, to driver/passenger and baggage? My ride in a T-REX was not a comforting experience because of the rear wheel drive. I hope the Elio is a totally different handling vehicle.

Have you attended a Teacher's 'professional development days' workshop to know what goes on too verify your generalized 4 day holiday weekend statement? Did you have a crappy K-12 experience? Teachers didn't care about you or provide you with some educational guidance helping to make some better choices along the way. The Professional development you mention is generally State required to maintain Teacher Certification requirements. Frankly, most teachers I know would rather be in the classroom.

I doubt many on this forum were born into entitlement either.

 

[Reid3400]

Is using sick time for other purposes not "entitlement"? It seems to be an accepted practice by some, with what is considered an entitlement mentality. A right to bend the rules for personal gain. It costs business, taxpayers and ultimately consumers their dollars. It also ends up costing some people their jobs when they get contracted out. All governments at all levels are now eliminating jobs with high burdens they can not control. Burdens such as sick time and personal time. I do now remember a position I held in the 1990's which had a long list of allowable personal time; immediate family sickness, funerals, children's birthdays, graduation, etc. I don't remember car shows being on the list!

 

[Thomas Maule]

Is using sick time for other purposes not "entitlement"? It seems to be an accepted practice by some, with what is considered an entitlement mentality. A right to bend the rules for personal gain. It costs business, taxpayers and ultimately consumers their dollars. It also ends up costing some people their jobs when they get contracted out. All governments at all levels are now eliminating jobs with high burdens they can not control. Burdens such as sick time and personal time. I do now remember a position I held in the 1990's which had a long list of allowable personal time; immediate family sickness, funerals, children's birthdays, graduation, etc. I don't remember car shows being on the list!

I think you are just going to have to accept that there are many people that have lives you cannot imagine, and do things for reasons you have never considered...

 

[Rickb]

Using sick days for any other reason than a sick day isn't entitlement it's reason for dismissal unless ok'd by management. I don't think anybody suggested it, but personal days, if you are fortunate enough to have them, are fine for car shows or whatever since it's personal days.

However, what I really didn't understand is why you would target the Teaching Profession.

 

[Elio Amazed]

You are 100% correct. Never heard of paid personal days. Yes, to paid "professional development days" for school teachers, which is just a union euphemism for a 4 day holiday weekend, always on a Friday to go with the government mandated Monday holiday. Never took a paid sick day in my life, unless I was sick. I am in the wrong generation, not born into the one of entitlement. Sorry you take offense to the suggestion of how I would manage my finances and rationalize donating $100 for a good cause, while getting in line to see if there is anything in the sack ("T" shirt I just bought)?
In the past 2 years, I have actually gone from wanting an Elio, to thinking it will never happen, to in the last 30 days thinking it has a 60% chance of happening by late 2016. Every trip I take in our $5800 Miata, which we purchased over 10 years ago, I think of what fun an Elio might be. I wonder if it will corner as well and be as idiot proof? Will an Elio under-steer or over-steer? How will the handling change from driver, to driver/passenger and baggage? My ride in a T-REX was not a comforting experience because of the rear wheel drive. I hope the Elio is a totally different handling vehicle.

I never said a word about how you manage your finances, as I couldn't care less about you choose manage your finances.

I take serious offense to your blatant implication that...
The only way I could possibly not see that the way you "handle your finances"...
Is superior thinking or some kind of "better decision" is that I work for minimum wage and math was "not my best subject".
You made your meaning quite clear in one of your posts and no amount of twisting is going to change that.

While I have specifically supported you and others against a previous poster's statement...
That those who have "no skin in the game" do not belong on this site...
I do not believe that blatantly insulting fellow members while debating or not debating their posts...
Is acceptable behavior on any site, or for that matter in any medium, regardless of it's subject matter.

Throughout reading your last four posts, I'm beginning to find it difficult to follow your rambling.
I'm beginning to wonder what any of those four posts have to do with each other.

It's unfortunate that you've never heard of the very common paid personal days we have here in the States.
I'm talking about throughout much of our entire private industry sector. I wasn't even thinking about government positions.
I guess that it might be considered commendable that you've taken paid sick days only when you were actually sick.
But here, in both private and public situations where people do not have paid personal days at their disposal...
The given unofficial purpose of paid sick days has evolved to include calling off for personal reasons.

Whether you consider that to be 'moral' or not is irrelevant. That is the reality of the issue.

In many, many cases, paid sick days and paid personal days are such that if you don't use them, you simply loose them.

And, when many apply personal pay to the day on which they call off, the reason for the call off is none of the company's business.

How you went from trying to say I'm wrong about the early opters demographics... to what seems to be...
A combination of ranting about your government's workers and 'educating' me about the 'morals' involved in paid time off...
Is quite utterly confusing but admittedly absolutely fastinating.

 

[Reid3400]

Using sick days for any other reason than a sick day isn't entitlement it's reason for dismissal unless ok'd by management. I don't think anybody suggested it, but personal days, if you are fortunate enough to have them, are fine for car shows or whatever since it's personal days.

However, what I really didn't understand is why you would target the Teaching Profession.

The only example I can think of is the teaching "profession", the only one in our area which uses "professional development days" for personal use. There is no requirement to attend an organized function. For more general information see; https://learner.org/ for examples. You can sit at home and "take a coarse" with no time limit or expectation of completion. I also reviewed our current district teachers contract. Teachers can no longer take a year off with pay for stress, only a semester. But the list of acceptable leaves with pay, boggles the mind. We have 13,700 students in our district and over 1440 FTE teaching positions, plus assistants, (not including administrators) yet we constantly have service disruptions (not strikes) in the name of "better quality education" which they claim can be had by reducing class size from 40 students. Teachers further demand many more special needs assistants as they claim up to 10 students per class need extra personal attention. If all the teachers were in the class rooms, not on various types of leave, we would have a maximum of 10 students per room. I have talked to many teachers who do not deny the student/teacher numbers, but their standard answer is "you do not understand." No, I do not. 13700 / 1440 = 9.5. Total district staff exceeds 2000. The Professional Development Day has been renamed a Non-Instruction Day since 2014 (to eliminate any public confusion). So now we have every Friday afternoon as Non-instruction time, plus 7 entire Fridays per year. Most people work 2000 hours per year. Are there any other "professions" enjoying these working conditions? They accumulate at 1.5 days per month over the entire length of service. One neighbourhood teacher was very upset to "loose" over a year of accumulated sick leave because of a motorcycle accident 2 years before retirement. The auto insurance paid him full salary until retirement, so he did not get to collect his sick leave. Lastly sick days only require a letter from a health professional if they exceed 2 consecutive days.

 

[Thomas Maule]

Dude, you can know everything in the world about every teachers job in the entire world and still not be qualified to judge an unknown persons reasoning... I don't understand the purpose of all this minutia... it's irrelevant.

 

[Reid3400]

I never said a word about how you manage your finances, as I couldn't care less about you choose manage your finances.

I take serious offense to your blatant implication that...
The only way I could possibly not see that the way you "handle your finances"...
Is superior thinking or some kind of "better decision" is that I work for minimum wage and math was "not my best subject".
You made your meaning quite clear in one of your posts and no amount of twisting is going to change that.

While I have specifically supported you and others against a previous poster's statement...
That those who have "no skin in the game" do not belong on this site...
I do not believe that blatantly insulting fellow members while debating or not debating their posts...
Is acceptable behavior on any site, or for that matter in any medium, regardless of it's subject matter.

Throughout reading your last four posts, I'm beginning to find it difficult to follow your rambling.
I'm beginning to wonder what any of those four posts have to do with each other.

It's unfortunate that you've never heard of the very common paid personal days we have here in the States.
I'm talking about throughout much of our entire private industry sector. I wasn't even thinking about government positions.
I guess that it might be considered commendable that you've taken paid sick days only when you were actually sick.
But here, in both private and public situations where people do not have paid personal days at their disposal...
The given unofficial purpose of paid sick days has evolved to include calling off for personal reasons.

Whether you consider that to be 'moral' or not is irrelevant. That is the reality of the issue.

In many, many cases, paid sick days and paid personal days are such that if you don't use them, you simply loose them.

And, when many apply personal pay to the day on which they call off, the reason for the call off is none of the company's business.

How you went from trying to say I'm wrong about the early opters demographics... to what seems to be...
A combination of ranting about your government's workers and 'educating' me about the 'morals' involved in paid time off...
Is quite utterly confusing but admittedly absolutely fastinating.

I do not have a ticket for the sack which may or may not contain an Elio in the end. I do have a great interest in the Elio and all Tadpole Trikes. I did a lot of searching after learning my long time friend supplied the 16 Geo motors and has several reservations. I continue to follow every whisper of possibility there will be an Elio. When it becomes a probability, I will get in the line.
The demographics of dreamer/gamblers are interesting, but totally irrelevant, as are the morals of same. The idea that morals can evolve is rather puzzling? Norms may evolve, but I think morals should not. Theft from ones employer of product or time, should still be a moral issue.