Electric Elio?

[Lil4X]

The problem with any alternative fuel is going to be availability. Without a real commitment to electricity, hydrogen, or a proton pack in every car, you can't expect a supportive infrastructure to appear on every street corner overnight. Until then, it's going to be a chicken or egg situation . . . nobody's going to build a EV port in your neighborhood because it can't afford the real estate investment for so little business potential. Sorry, but you're stuck charging your EV at home for the next few years. If you intend to do any more than a daily commute, you're going to need to pack a bag and a pillow, because a charge will take several hours - that is until charging times can be reduced to a few minutes.

Whether you use hydrogen or compressed natural gas, there is going to be a whole lot of fail-safe technology that has to be developed for the dispenser before Johnny Undershirt can safely fill his pickup. It's just not there yet because there's no demand. I'm afraid of the guy who fills the tanks for my grill. He was trying to sell me fertilizer earlier, I'm not too sure about his ability to fill a propane tank without blowing us up.

 

[Coss]

Just add hydrogen to existing gas stations; just like they do propane.
One interesting point about hydrogen; it can be made from methane.
Since they have automatic milking stations for cows, hang a methane collection bag on their butts, and when they go to get milked, change the fart bag.
Since they have methane wells at landfills, you could have processing plants next to the landfill to act like a distribution center. They've got to have (or close to) landfills in just about every town.
I'm just wondering around possibility land for a while; it's the Sunday after a clock change, so everything is just a tick "off" so to say.

 

[NSTG8R]

Just add hydrogen to existing gas stations; just like they do propane.
One interesting point about hydrogen; it can be made from methane.
Since they have automatic milking stations for cows, hang a methane collection bag on their butts, and when they go to get milked, change the fart bag.
Since they have methane wells at landfills, you could have processing plants next to the landfill to act like a distribution center. They've got to have (or close to) landfills in just about every town.
I'm just wondering around possibility land for a while; it's the Sunday after a clock change, so everything is just a tick "off" so to say.

To Lil4x and your point about refueling. Husky, a company not far from my house, makes every nozzle for every gas pump in the US (maybe globally), but they had an article in the SLPD about an automated refueling robot. This might be just the thing for hydrogen refueling. Take human error/distraction out of the equation.

As for production, I'm no expert but it seems like hydroelectric power stations would be perfect. You've got the water, you've got the electricity, so when the power station is operating during non-peak hours, instead of by-passing the flow, let the turbines run and use it for electrolysis.

http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/...cle_cbdbeee6-f167-51c0-a1fd-c9c65d715a1c.html

 

[Jambe]

Hydrogen doesn't store well.

 

[Sethodine]

It seems to me that (nearly) every home in the country has electricity and water access. With rooftop solar and/or grid power, you could crack your own hydrogen fuel at home and fill up your car whenever. Public stations don't need complicated infrastructure, you just produce the hydrogen fuel locally.

Sure, I understand that electrolysis is a slow process, and that industrial-quantities might not be feasible for public stations. My point is just....why must all fueling come from centralized infrastructure? 99% of our EV charging happens at home; the number of times we've needed a public station I can count on one hand. I just don't worry about where stations are anymore, because we never need them. Hydrogen fuel-cell could be that way, too, only better.

 

[Coss]

You can get hydrogen from more than just water. You can get it from water yes, but also methane, propane, natural gas and couple of others.
Here's a great article about hydrogen fuel cell cars and trucks, and the fuel (one of the better one's I've found so far, and it's in simple English terms.


http://www.edmunds.com/fuel-economy/8-things-you-need-to-know-about-hydrogen-fuel-cell-cars.html

 

[Marshall]

You can get hydrogen from more than just water. You can get it from water yes, but also methane, propane, natural gas and couple of others.
Here's a great article about hydrogen fuel cell cars and trucks, and the fuel (one of the better one's I've found so far, and it's in simple English terms.


http://www.edmunds.com/fuel-economy/8-things-you-need-to-know-about-hydrogen-fuel-cell-cars.html

The difference is CLEAN processes using water Hydrogen 2 parts and Oxygen one part. All the rest have waste CO and CO2 as a component. The latter being far cleaner than the CO. But they also have contaminants.

 

[AriLea]

So you're old enough to remember the time that our great climate concern was the inevitable upcoming ICE AGE we were entering. I've seen Crisis agitators all my life and the evidence they use is often contrived or more often, misrepresented.

If you want a crisis, just measure temperatures beginning at 6 AM and ending at 3PM and you'll have "evidence" of global warming. Or, start measuring at 6 PM and end at 3AM and you'll have evidence for Global Freezing.

Most of the "evidence" has been manipulated to get funding and other is simply misunderstanding of very long term cycles.

The man made portion is appropriately compared to spitting in the ocean because all we do is a small fraction of naturally occurring processes. You can manipulate one side of the equation and ignore it's effects all day if you want to raise the alarm, and get grant money.

ps Recorded history is far too brief to determine what normal is, particularly with great fear over half a degree change based on measurements with precision of plus or minus 5 degrees for most of it's time.

Frankly, I'm looking more at the species extinctions, and deforestation and loss of diversity(undeniable results of human activity). I'm not worried about the next 15years. Between 20 and 1000? Now I'm worried.

By way of example, One of the effects of a less diverse world is the disease front. When you have a monolithic world of one planetary species, all interconnected, things get dicey. The way that pests and fungus exploit industrial crops is a representative model. Keeping some level of diversity, even like mixed rows of crops has a positive effect compared to the single monolithic style. That's one protection modern life has lost already. All you need is one properly designed microbe.

The worst one would be 4week+ incubation, with-out heavy early symptoms, transmissible from day2, transmitted in the air, retrovirus, re-infectious, and high death rate or permanent damage. Let's say like a super Zirka.

Anyway, yes, it seems nasty to ask any particular person, in fact the general public to consider such things. But who then? You think the CDC can make all the plans and take all the actions needed to avoid such things? They aren't the one in charge of the environment.

Here would be a reasoned adjustment, internationally, stop shaking hands and have all public doors be automatic, foot or voice activated. Maintain an arms length distance from other humans. A bit weird, but not hard to do.

 

[RUCRAYZE]

Ummm...I see this conversation entering the taboo realm of religion and politics.

So...How about a scaled down version of this beauty.

http://www.electricautosport.com/2016/03/hydrogen-fuel-cell-lmp3-racer-delft/

Sure, hydrogen refueling stations are few and far between, but if the infrastructure was there I think that a hydrogen top-off on a trip would much quicker than waiting for a battery to recharge. Range-wise, I don't know enough about fuel cells and their rate of hydrogen consumption per kwh, but I'm going to keep an eye out for news about the above noted race...They said something about an April 1 test bench run.

Give me a vehicle with a 100kw hydrogen fuel cell with a 0 - 60 mph in 4 seconds, and you might convince me that EVs are the way to go.

Just an example of what can be done...note at 0:21 into the video, a sweet view of the Flat Irons in Boulder. My absolute favorite range in CO.

TY