Elio Motors @ New York Auto Show 2015

[Ekh]

Just to clarify things a bit EM is not abandoning the current ongoing 506(C) fundraising process to raise $30 million as Paul Elio mentioned this specifically in the press conference. EM is actually expanding that offering with the addition of a new brokerage firm providing more services. EM is also apparently preparing to expand their fundraising effort to take advantage of the new equity crowdfunding option for both accredited and non-accredited investors which is becoming available thanks to the new SEC rules taking effect in June.

I am just taking a stab in the dark here however my guess is that when the general equity crowdfunding option becomes available we will see an offer for reservation holders to prepay for their vehicles in the form of an investment in the company. EM needs the money now to push the project forward so what they are likely hoping is that as it becomes more widely apparent that this project will succeed then it will be easier to find further investors for production and/or receive ATVM loan. EM would use future funding to actually cover the cost of building the vehicles they are promising to investors who prepay for their vehicle early. I do not know what incentive EM would give investors who prepay, locking in the $6800 price?, however remember that from the EM plans we have seen the actual cost (including corporate and plant overhead, parts, and labor) of building the vehicle is only about 60% of the retail cost of the vehicle with the rest going towards profit margin and costs beyond actually building the vehicle so EM does have some wiggle room in there.

For those wondering about the new SEC rules regarding equity crowdfunding as investments this article does a pretty good job explaining what is happening: http://www.forbes.com/sites/chanceb...s-equity-crowdfunding-with-jobs-act-title-iv/

Does anybody know how many $1000 all-in investors there are at the moment? I've seen varying numbers on this. Paul said, if memory serves, that there are some 14,000 all-inners, but did he mean at the $1,000 level? If that all there are, it's not a big pool to draw from in seeking additional investment, because, after all, we're already taking a risk. But maybe there would be enough to help out, though I doubt there'd be enough to swing the prototypes into action.

I can see investors who are all-inners being given a direct application of the money to their vehicle cost (pre-paying, in effect) PLUS dividend-bearing stock. People mainly invest for capital growth or dividend (income). Pre-paying for a car isn't, strictly speaking, an investment.

G1, are you seriously saying that the cost of labor, materials, and overhead to build an Elio is only around $4,000? That's really hard to believe! Or is your profit estimate perhaps including CAFE credits?

 

[Folks]

[QUOTE="goofyone, post: 97083, member: 531" An interested investor with deep pockets, well funded group of investors, and/or the government ATVM program could show up at any time and completely change EM's production outlook.[/QUOTE]

Of course we know that tight money really started in 2008 when certain elitist politicians attempted to socially engineer Bank loans ( you see they are superior in their thinking than you and I )and thus destroyed the trusts all Banking is built on. Both Crowd Investing and the Elio are alike in my book in that they both are attempts to work around problems both caused and bungled by elitist leftists like Barney Franks, Chuck Schumer, Chris Dodd. So if they have anything to do with it, count me out. Nothing is worth that. LOL You and I would have been buried under the jail for what they've done. Oh and please don't accept any money from George Soros. If it were not for the indomitable free enterprise spirit in this Country I'd have given up on this heap of humanity we call Government a long time ago. Rock on.

 

[Rickb]

The laws may change in 60 days making it easier for EM to raise money. However, 60 is the first of June. Is there still going to be enough time to raise the money, do all the work and still make it into production in time? There is so much that still needs to be done.

I thought I heard Paul Elio mention in the news conference video that 2016 might not be possible because there is much to do.

EM is actually much further along in this project than most people may realize. EM has completed the vehicle engineering, have a running IAV engine in testing, have their suppliers lined up, have a plant site, and have laid out the plant layout, equipment, and tooling needs with Comau. With these basics covered if EM had the money today, either completely in hand or committed, then as long as there are not any show stopping issues encountered along the way EM could be in production in about six months as vehicle testing can happen concurrently with the plant being set up.

In some ways this relatively short time period for actual physical work is what makes it harder for us to predict when production will happen as the production timeline is almost entirely dictated by funding which makes it nearly impossible to predict with any certainty. An interested investor with deep pockets, well funded group of investors, and/or the government ATVM program could show up at any time and completely change EM's production outlook.

It would also change my outlook! lol I seem to be crossing back and forth over the line to the dark side. Help me!

 

[Rickb]

Does anybody know how many $1000 all-in investors there are at the moment? I've seen varying numbers on this. Paul said, if memory serves, that there are some 14,000 all-inners, but did he mean at the $1,000 level? If that all there are, it's to a big pool to draw from n seeking additional investment, because, after all, we're already taking a risk. But maybe there would be enough to help out, though I doubt there'd be enough to swing the prototypes into action.

I can see investors who are all-inners being given a direct application of the money to their vehicle cost (pre-paying, in effect) PLUS dividend-bearing stock. People mainly invest for capital growth or dividend (income). Pre-paying for a car isn't, strictly speaking, an investment.

G1, are you seriously saying that the cost of labor, materials, and overhead to build an Elio is only around $4,000? That's really hard to believe! Or is your profit estimate perhaps including CAFE credits?

The Elio doesn't currently and may never qualify for CAFE Credits.

 

[Ekh]

An interested investor with deep pockets, well funded group of investors, and/or the government ATVM program could show up at any time and completely change EM's production outlook.

Well, maybe. The ATVM business, hopefully. But we're still at square one -- a "well funded group of investors" is going to want some say in the business and probably a significant amount of stock and the control that goes with it. That's been the sticking point all along in finding investors. The big boys want control, and Paul wants to keep his baby intact. The mass-market investment plan offers a way around that IF it works. So far Elio has attracted car buyers, but not equipment buyers (so far as we know). For many people, $1,000 for an unbuilt car is as big a risk as they're willing to take.

I'd like to see a breakout of ALL the costs in getting through the first year's production, AND the cost-per-car, including overhead and existing debt service, AND how the stock is currently held. THEN it might look like an investment instead of a flyer. Right now, it's a flyer. People do invest on their feelings, but at some point you have to do a risk analysis and make that a big part of your decision making.

 

[NSTG8R]

I can see investors who are all-inners being given a direct application of the money to their vehicle cost (pre-paying, in effect) PLUS dividend-bearing stock. People mainly invest for capital growth or dividend (income). Pre-paying for a car isn't, strictly speaking, an investment.

I like that idea.

 

[RUCRAYZE]

Absolutely. Elon Musk sticks his foot in his mouth on occasion. But we still want to hear what he has to say.

Keep Paul talking. Real person. Real passion. Real accountability.

Yes, Musk can keep talking he can "afford to"- he got the cash, loans and the best vehicle rated by Consumer's. Building on success, is so much easier.
Paul has that habit of inappropriate little laugh, not after a "joke" or cool insight seems to put it in at odd times- I know it's not intentional , least we forget he's an engineer first. I think EM would be best served in this arena with a dude that knows the product as well as Paul, but the polished assurdeness of a P.R. staffer.

 

[RUCRAYZE]

Does anybody know how many $1000 all-in investors there are at the moment? I've seen varying numbers on this. Paul said, if memory serves, that there are some 14,000 all-inners, but did he mean at the $1,000 level? If that all there are, it's not a big pool to draw from in seeking additional investment, because, after all, we're already taking a risk. But maybe there would be enough to help out, though I doubt there'd be enough to swing the prototypes into action.

I can see investors who are all-inners being given a direct application of the money to their vehicle cost (pre-paying, in effect) PLUS dividend-bearing stock. People mainly invest for capital growth or dividend (income). Pre-paying for a car isn't, strictly speaking, an investment.

G1, are you seriously saying that the cost of labor, materials, and overhead to build an Elio is only around $4,000? That's really hard to believe! Or is your profit estimate perhaps including CAFE credits?

yes 14k with "a Number" and T shirt -dedicated place in line. (with the exception of fleet sales?)

 

[goofyone]

....
I'd like to see a breakout of ALL the costs in getting through the first year's production, AND the cost-per-car, including overhead and existing debt service, AND how the stock is currently held. THEN it might look like an investment instead of a flyer. Right now, it's a flyer. People do invest on their feelings, but at some point you have to do a risk analysis and make that a big part of your decision making.

I would bet that current investors are being given access to all the information you asked about as this would be standard investment information but of course would be subject to non-disclosure agreements. We do however have have an Elio Motors financial plan from 2012 as provided to the Caddo Parrish commission. The specific numbers would have obviously changed since then however the general plan has not likely changed much so this document provides great insight into how EM's financials are structured and I would bet that current investors are likely provided with an updated version of this very same document as it appears that EM has been working off this document, and modifying it as needed, since very early on.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Bxh8JmkBAL7weUJKTFBFQmJuRVE/

.....
G1, are you seriously saying that the cost of labor, materials, and overhead to build an Elio is only around $4,000? That's really hard to believe! Or is your profit estimate perhaps including CAFE credits?

This is the 'Vehicle Cost' tab of the EM financial spreadsheet discussed above. It looks like I was a bit off in remembering the exact percentage however the fully manufactured cost is still less than 75% of the retail price and it would make sense that EM would be moving the numbers to keep that percentage about the same.

Just from what has leaked out over time I am certain that Paul Elio is not exaggerating when he says that he has the numbers to back up his claims.

 

[Elio Amazed]

It's just sad when any manufacturer predicts that advertising costs will be almost 8% of the cost of each and every vehicle sold.